Real concern about a friend...

RE: Real concern about a friend...

Steph S — Wed, 30 Jun 2010 21:36:02 GMT

Adam - Thanks for the tips. I've discussed my own Vipassana & noting experiences with my friend before and he was curious about it. Good to know that it's not something he should try because at an earlier point I may have suggested it to him. Since he was receptive to what I've told him on that topic, perhaps choiceless awareness (which I've done a slim amount of) might be easy to persuade him to do. Although I will say, I'm hesitant to tell him to try anything new that's meditation related for fear that it might have some sort of opposite effect and reinforce things.

Joel - Thank you too. I was doing a google search for spirituality and psychology, so that organization seems very helpful. I'll get in touch with someone in their database near my area to feel things out and see what they advise.

Thanks again. Here's hoping this turns out well.

Steph

RE: Real concern about a friend...

J Groove — Wed, 30 Jun 2010 12:52:36 GMT

Hi Yana Pets.
Here's a link to the Spiritual Emergence Network.
http://www.spiritualemergence.info/

This is an organization founded in part by Stanislav Grof, the pioneering consciousness researcher. It is dedicated to helping people integrate and cope with severe kundalini awakenings and other spiritual openings that are usually dismissed by Western scientific materialism. I've read some accounts of the work these people do and it seems like they might be able to either give you some solid advice on how to work constructively with your friend, or even work directly with your friend, should he be open to the idea.
Best of luck!
Joel

RE: Real concern about a friend...

J Adam G — Wed, 30 Jun 2010 06:54:39 GMT

Well, I could go on about western psychiatric concepts like dissociative disorders, and reality checking, and cognitive training, but since he won't accept any of that...

I'm reminded of Ajahn Chah's recommendation for dealing with people in situations like this. According to the simple 3-type model of personality found in the Vimuttimagga (among other, more complex models of personality), this individual would be of the predominantly deluded type, as opposed to desirous or aversive types. Ajahn Chah always recommended gentle and simple practices for people with significant amounts of delusion, with a focus on gentle and accepting mindfulness.

Actual vipassana practice is not recommended in this situation by the Ajahn, or by the Vimuttimagga or Visuddhimagga. What is recommended is developing an accepting mindfulness, with the aim of gradually reducing the delusion by immersing the person in reality. Concentration practices are also not recommended. The practical reasons for not recommending these advanced meditations is that it could be disastrous to trigger dark night or siddhi stuff in such a person. (Thank you Vimuttimagga for being so practical, and less bogged down in doctrine than most other commentaries!)

So, is there any way you could influence him to look at some gentle choiceless awareness practices, without a particular emphasis on investigation or absorption but rather just on seeing what's happening in the present moment, and accepting that it's happening without spinning in thought or content?

Real concern about a friend...

Steph S — Wed, 30 Jun 2010 04:02:14 GMT

I have a friend who was raised by a traditional Hindu family, started meditating at the age of 12, had his first out of body experiences at the age of 14, followed by what he says was a mental breakdown (not knowing how to deal with his "lost" identity at such a young age). He stopped meditating after that, but he said around age 18 he heard the voice of a divine feminine being speak very loudly to him. He was about to attempt suicide because he said he wanted to escape the human world and be totally with the divine, and the voice told him to stop, so he did. No further suicide attempts, according to him. The divine voice didn't come again all too often after that, but within the past couple of years (he's now 30) he claims to have developed full fledged clairaudience (same divine feminine voice from age 18 is now his spiritual guide).

He uses this medium to give readings over the telephone, a few of which I have been in the room to overhear what he is saying. In the readings I've heard, he was answering callers questions about relationships. Whether the readings are accurate according to callers, I have no idea, but what he has said would appear plausible if one believed mediumship is legitimately connected to a higher spiritual being (admittedly, I don't).

Here's where I get really worried. He went to India recently and had an experience where he says he became possessed/directly experienced Darshan - via the Divine Mother (higher spiritual force than his regular guide) and lost all sense of self or attachment in a state of total ecstasy.... and the divine mother possessed him to slit his wrists to sacrifice some of his blood to her. As if that isn't scary enough for anyone to wrap their head around, he says he feels blessed that this happened and claims it has nothing to do with "him" doing it and its occurrence was completely out of his control. When I expressed a lot of concern over this and the possibility that it could happen again, or more seriously that he sacrificed himself entirely at some point (i.e. suicide, which is not far fetched considering prior attempt at 18)... he said his mother doesn't make mistakes and even if he did die, he doesn't care, he's not attached to his body and if that was his destiny, so be it.

I think he's at serious risk here and needs help... However, it's very unlikely he'll get it since he thinks Western psychology is pretty much bullshit and is very vested in his beliefs. I contacted a cousin of his, whom also knows about all his spiritual beliefs and experiences. His cousin said he's talked with him before and suggested he get supervision when doing any work at this level because it is risky and he could waste a potential gift. The cousin also said he's in no position to force him to do anything or watch over him entirely, obviously, but that I should keep checking up. So it appears that although cousin is worried too, he to a degree legitimizes the belief system by saying it's okay to continue with the mediumship if supervised and thinking it is a gift... so I'm not sure how much help he'll be. Does anyone here have experience dealing with this sort of thing.. any advice of what else I could do to help?