Okay, I'm going to go ahead and start a new log here, as my perspective has changed.  Most importantly, I think I have totally misunderstood the set of methods that will lead to an actual freedom as well as what an actual freedom really is.  I don't necessarily want to do much conceptualizing because I think it will hold me back and I also have a very primitive/elementary understanding of actualism at this point, so I'm just going to go right into the practice component for now.  So here we go!

8/8/15

So my goal is to enjoy and appreciate as much as possible.  Eventually, the goal is to have these good-feelings be only related to the present moment.  The enhancement of these good-feelings to the utmost would be what is known as a 'pure consciousness experience.'  However, I can't get to that level of feeling good with a linear, goal-orientation.  Also, in general, there is the notion of moving out of this 'real world' of social beliefs and expectations and into the actual world of the physical universe.  However, I currently think that I have to work from within my identity in order to get out of it.

So this is what I'm doing:  Just being myself, relaxing, chilling out, encouraging feelings of pride, ego & self-esteem (for the time being only!!) (just to develop a solid platform/momentum of feeling good), encouraging feelings of aggression, masculinity, etc. (same thing), taking a playful & humorous outlook (very important, I believe), etc.

edit: just to add to this and summarize it, I think what I am trying to say above is that a deeper sense of "not caring", meaning not being attached to lots of insecurities that usually bind me down, is condusive to feeling good more of the time... that is all.

8/9/15

So just following my logic from yesterday, I have further specified some immediate goals towards a more stable and long-lasting feeling good.  Most importantly, I have to try to get serious about the new job that I am working in the new city that I just moved to (Seattle, as of two weeks ago, today).  I will not feel secure or happy if I am not doing my job well, or trying not to care about my job.  These things will just cause dissonance within.  Once I have learned my job, I can worry about things like getting situated socially, etc.  Eventually, I'll be able to let my new life run on autopilot, at which time I will be better situated to run the HAIETMOBA technology and actually begin to drop unnecessary parts.

Replace this kind of thought, "I will not feel secure or happy if I am not doing my job well, or trying not to care about my job." with, "I am enjoying learning my new job and the security it makes me feel."  Replace, "Once I have learned my job, I can worry about things like getting situated socially, etc." with, "I am doing a good job dealing with things one at a time and I'm open to making new friends because it's fun."

There will always be something to worry about because worry has nothing to do with the objects it settles on.  It's a type of thinking that dominates a mind that is searching for closure.  Instead of looking forward to the end of your problems, convert your thoughts about your problems into an identity that can deal with anything on the go, in the flow.  Nothing ends, everything just continues.  Being happy is much simpler than it seems.  You just need to view your current circumstances positively.  Moving is an adventure, not a trial.  Learning a new job is a mind-expanding opportunity, not an obstacle to overcome.  If you can work with the mind rather than try to change it, you'll have a much easier time.  Be a rudder, not a dam.

Hey nt, agreed!  I will start n this today.

Edit: I realize later (the next day), that this partially misreprents my mindset.  I am not trying to reach a point of having an all-around adaptable identity.  Rather, its that I work better with hard, specific, and temporary goals, i.e. get good enough at job not to worry about it.  This goal does have to do with using my identity, but eventually, having no identity is the goal.  So I actually only partially agree.

8/11

Following my logic from the past two days, I realize that thinking I must get good at my job in order to progress in actualism is a mistake.  The idea of needing to be good at a job links in with the whole schtick about society, wage slavery, peasant mentality, etc (btw I love these ideas but I'm still learning about them so bear with me).  I can make a decision to not get roped into all of that bs.  The idea is that this life is inherently enjoyable, regardless of what is happening to me in this small little personal world that I create out of my limited sense data.  Life is BIG, and good shit is always happening; in fact, life IS good shit.  

So the best possible attitude right now might be to say that even if I mess up at my job (worst case scenario), I will still feel good.  It is obviously a good and practical thing to try hard at a job, but that should not be tied in to my mood.  Ideally, my mood would always range between good and great, regardless of circumstance.  

Just some food for thought.

-------------------------------------------
C
I also realize that there are a lot of other pressures I put on myself which I will have to give up if I want to enjoy and appreciate full time.  One big one is the desire to pump up my ego through success in dating and sexuality.  Another one is the need to get a certain type of 'professional' job which will pay a certain salary.  A third is to eat healthy, and a fourth is to become a well-rounded person with an excellent fund of knowledge.  At the center of it all is the basic, societal psyche that keeps us all plugged into this matrix.  To the immediate periphery of that core lies my own psychodynamics: the way I pressure myself.  Basically, the idea is to actually be free from it all, as it is happening (and, in general, to stop it from happening and feel good in a more present way instead).  To do that requires a certain degree of awareness with some conceptual framework (to fill in the blanks where there is not yet direct experience, i.e. PCE), which is why I am writing all of this.  

Many of these pressures are very attractive and seductive; they hit very close to home.  In the end, it comes down to truly falling out of love with these things and choosing the actualist path instead.  Note: I am not talking about ascetic-type giving up; if anything I am talking about giving up all the conventional ways of seeing and replacing them with pure hedonism instead.

Cheers.

note: a lot of this stuff involves not listening to these storylines (which is what not tao has been telling me to do for awhile).  It is a literal, saying "no", internally, to these things.  But you have to know why you're saying no, and for me, it helps to understand the mechanics of what is happening.  But yeah, the basic thing is saying "fuck you" to the collective human psyche, and choosing to really have fun instead of worry about survival (which is what the majority of our internal experience is based on-both positive and negative emotions, of course).

It's even simpler than that - you can just enjoy pursuing them! If you want something, and you think you can't be happy until you stop wanting it, then you're still making conditions.  You're trying to make an "Actualist" identity here and put it in place of the social identity.  If you want to eat healthy and become a well rounded person, all you need to do is enjoy the process of eating healthy and learning more things and stop focusing on the end results.  The identity is made of constraints and self-checks.  It creates a whole imaginary world where you've already decided the future.  By removing this focus you can just do everything naturally without thinking, "Is this right?  Is this wrong?  Where will I end up?" - even persuing your desires.  I think the main thing Richard is trying to point to is at the very core of the question, "what am I supposed to be doing right now?"  If you are asking yourself that, you're monitoring yourself and keeping yourself in check.  To be free of that is to just enjoy what's happening without any concept of a proper way to act codified into the situation.  There's nothing you're ever supposed to be doing.  "Supposed to" is the social identity.  It's easy to turn this into, "stop thinking about the future," and, "stop worrying about what will happen," but it's not that!  That is just more "supposed to!"  See how that works?  There's really nothing you need to do, you can relax.

You can really simplify this down to "enjoying and appreciating this moment of being alive."  If you want something, then enjoy the process of figuring out how you're going to get it.  If you don't get it, enjoy the process of giving it up, or persuing other things, or doing nothing at all.  There is no code you need to follow, and no system you need to internalize.  The goal is actually the opposite - to get rid of those feelings of should, could, would, must, need, and have to, and replace them with enjoyment.

It doesn't have to be either/or.  I actually thought this for a long time and it made things difficult.  If you're worried about something, you can't just magically abandon the feeling.  It's your mind's way of displaying how important you think things are, and while it may be possible in time to stop giving importance to everything, this isn't very practical since living requires maintenance and upkeep (like eating, a job, etc.)  You can whittle thigns down to the bare essentials and still end up worrying the same amount you did before because there is still something to look after.  You can't escape living until you die!  I found that working with the "imaginary world" of outcomes is much easier.  You don't have to make things unimportant, you can just live optimistically instead and this allows the mind to settle problems quickly without stress.

Anyway, it can be hard to really convey this because there's always this temptation to look for new rules to follow.  Even, "enjoy this moment," turns into a code to follow or something to practice until it's mastered.  It's not like that.  It's just relaxing and letting go of the idea of rules.  You don't have to do anything, which means you can give yourself permission to enjoy the process of doing what you want and moving your life wherever you want it to go.  Be free from compulsion.  Freedom means you are in control, not emotional triggers or social taboos (even if those social taboos are coming from "Actualist society!").  Be your own person.

Yeah it's tricky.  I have found that if I do things because I really just feel like doing them, that works.  But if I do think because society says I should and I have internalized that, or I hope to get some specific outcome later, or because I think I have to for some reason, those motivations seem to be detrimental.  Plus I don't do as good a job on the tasks with those motivations.  Those are all future and past oriented motivations, they aren't living in the now.  As for bad moods, yeah, they can't be made to disappear like magic and feeling bad about not being able to feel good all the time does not help either!  ;-P  So if a bad mood, I try a different tact, get curious about its origins, explore the details from a scientific perspective, break it down into constituent parts, allow myself to be perfectly fine with feeling bad, which makes a strange kind of dichotomy in itself and changes my experience of the 'bad.'
-Eva

8/11

-Ok im at work right now, doing nt's approach, enjoying these early stages of doing the job, as well as all the little quirks of myself, coworkers and bosses. 

-@Eva: Interesting thoughts... sounds right in line with what I'm trying to do.

___________________

-So I 'downloaded' tons of new info today, through inspiration (I think this is called 'serendipity' in Actualism language).  Here it is, in no particular order:

• there is no basis for me not enjoying the moment once I get my perspective right.  The right perspective is one in which I realize that there is nothing I "should" be doing.... at its core, the "should" mechanism, is the self in action.
• other than that, its just a matter of being aware of all things that are occuring (inner and outer, pleasant and unpleasant), and including those things in this naturally arising enjoyment that I have uncovered
• sometimes, I have to purposely enjoy my personality, particularly after I become aware of some self-judgement and/or the negative trait that is being judged
• the joy of being alive is basically non-human... not involving fight, flight, love, hate, etc... not involving any type of survival.  Sort of a third type of magnetic charge other than these two poles (fight and flight) that is most in line with the charge of physical reality/nature
• it isn't effective to resist love but rather to experience it on par with all the other things and to see clearly, exactly what is happening when I feel love, where it comes from, and what it is leading to... this clear-seeing is also necessary for aggression, as well as the ASC's... 
• this clearly seeing is specifcally, that the self IS the emotional system
• harmlessness isn't important bc of societal-moral code or bc one has feelings of empathy for another, but bc people are ACTUALLY in pain, and this pain is some of the most complex expressions in all of life and nature and it is all around us, and therefore cant be ignored (especially when practicing attentiveness!!)... harmlessness becomes the only SENSIBLE desired reaction
• I have certain instinctual mechanisms (libido, hunger, agitation) which I know will be the last things to go bc they manifest so intensely... but I know not to try to dismantle them until I am ready and that some day I will be ready..... this is good news bc, in the end "right view" in actualism creates a motivation that is stronger than my deepest attachments  )))))

Okay, so just to summarize some of this "right view"/proper perspective that I have been developing in my actualist studies and practice:

Matter came before consciousness.  Physical actuality is all that there really is.  We are sensing this, but can't detect it because of all the other stuff that is going on.  Fundamentally, we are brains-on-sticks.... first, these brains activate in the amygdala/animal-survival-center as fight or flight/ nurture and aggression.... this is the raw materials of our entire self-psychology-mind-structure.... then from ages 3 to ages 7 we start to develop the neocortex center which synchs up with this whole societal network of rules... from then on there is constant communication between the animal structure and the human centers of the brain.... this cross-communication forms the basis of a sense of self, and all the other selfing activities that occur...

These selfing activities are most notably, the emotions... in that sense, "I" AM my emotions.... However, the selfing activities also include altered states of consciousness (asc's)... basically, enlightenment, as we know it, in all of its forms (super-vipassana-not-self/// boddhiccitta-ultimate-compassion//// shaktipat-all-is-energy-guru///// oneness-with-god-force-mystic) is a survival reflex, ..... it is the brain going in the exact opposite direction of being "here" AS the emotions, not aware of the emotions, but being the emotions and nothing more....  enlightenment is the most subtle survival reflex and shows how amazing our brains are at creating this illusion of personal life!!   It really is quite amazing.

Anyhoo, the best, smartest thing to do is to enjoy in the present moment.... the way to do this authentically is to include everything in that enjoyment... all the good and bad emotions are "you" and are to be brought into the wonder of this moment.... at the core, root, most essential level, the feeling of "should", the feeling that something else must happen, other than this moment of being alive, IS the self as I experience it most directly.... there are other, deeper layers, but I won't have access to them (until I do), and when I do, that will just take place in the present moment anyway, so I wont worry about that now (lol)... 

So, yeah, uncover basic joy after realizing that the self is the illusion of needing something to happen.... then just keep on keeping on with that enjoyment.... eventually, that enjoyment will lead to an excellence experience, and then to a PCE... and all the while, the fundamental view of actualism will be being developed, and the more mature my view and reasoning gets, the more sensible I will be, and the more I can rely on my intelligence instead of my emotions to both guide me through life, and through the wide and wondrous path of actualism.

@Pawel: I don't know man, I do a lot of playing with ideas without necessarily trying to assert absolute truths.  Thats why I put all of this stuff in my practice logs and not into discussions with others.  Whenever I post about concepts and not direct experience, it will be in my practice log.  It is possible that I have not been consistent with this in the past, but I have learned to do this over time.

As to any and all politics surrounding this stuff, I basically have no comment.  I don't want to try and incorporate the concept of emptiness into my log here because I am just gaining an introductory conceptual understanding of actualism.  So yeah, no comment on that either.

The bottom line for me is that I have gotten a great benefit from my vipassana practice (which I have asserted in all circumstances, including the yahoo af group), and I am seeking a different type of benefit from actualist practice now.  Whether or not the experience of emptiness (and its lasting side effects) is a survival mechanism, or a way of touching upon the deepest layer of human consciousness, it does not matter, because it is pragmatically beneficial; it has been tremendously psychotherapuetic for me, and has also alleviated most suffering related to fundamental-perceptual duality.  That does not mean that other types of relief are not possible.

I am utilizing these techiques to the best of my ability and trying to understand the concepts because that seems to be what works for me when it comes to mind-hacking systems that alleviate suffering.

Cheers.

I think this is all you need. Keep it simple. Simplicity is bliss.

I honestly don't feel qualified to speak about actualism, Mara, Buddhism, etc.  To quote one of my favorite rappers, MF Doom, "the more you know, the more you know you don't know shit."  So that has been the sort of theme for me lately, and also segues into "what draws me to actualism."  I am drawn to actualism because it makes the most sense to me, it seems to provide answers to questions that I still have.  These are the things that make sense to me:

1) That there are a variety of things that an identity will do in order to protect and preserve itself, including the creation of spots 'deep' inside the mind which can be unlocked to create the illusion that a changeless quality has been discovered.  
2) That 'I' am none other than the emotions, as well as the emotional core, and that the creation of all perception, including the sense of witness, is based around the struggle for survival in this world, starting with the deepest, animal instincts and evolving into the higher human functions.
3) That matter preceeds consciousness, which means that the brain preceeds perception, and that there is a way to shut off the survival-gripping functions of the brain, which would, in turn lead to seeing a whole, new world which was previously veiled by the emotion-goggles.
4) That this method and outcome would not have been accessible in the past due to the basic struggle for survival which humans have almost always had.  Previous attempts at finding unconditional happiness would have involved working from within the basic, affective sphere, and discovering seeming escapes from it while still having to deal with the terrible traumas of physical existence.

So, these make sense to me, now.  Those are the two keywords.  Everyone's opinion is subject to change.  I have a lot of baggage.  A lot of affective intensity.  I am seeking a way out.  Thats the simple answer of what draws me to actualism.

Pawel,

You can start a thread arguing to your heart's content about "actualism" in the Dharma Battllground section fo the site. This thread is in the actualist inspired practices  section of the DhO and is Noah's practice thread so please don't attempt to derail someone's practice becuase you disagree with it.. Unless of course they wish for it to occur. Noah?

Nick (Mod)

Nikolai .:

Thanks for the help, NIck.  I think for now, it would be best if we ceased the conceptual debate here, since my understanding is still minimal.  I will say that the discussion between Pawel and I thus far, has been conducive to my practice in that it is helping me hone my view.  However, such discussion has probably reached its peak, so yes, I would like to stop the debate here.


Pawel K:


For now, I think we'll just have to agree to disagree, since I am truly attempting to practice actualism as I have understood it through a decent amount of personal research as of late.  Let us pick up our sabres at a later date!

Yeah b man, I agree.  So perfect enjoyment all the time is in fact the final goal here (being synonymous with an actual freedom).  But there are so many little degrees of progress within, things to be realized, etc.  Fractals....

8/12

Not Tao's advice is still going great.  There are lots of little things that I can now choose to enjoy once I take the correct frame.  For instance, I can enjoy a little melee and chaos on the dho and other message boards.  I can enjoy the feeling of loneliness I get at night when my roommate and his girlfriend flee into their room.  I can enjoy the feeling of agitation, hunger and libido the spouts up like a fountain throughout the day.

I have to be careful not to disassociate in any way while I do this, including pasting pleasure over emotions, or going into jhana.  I have to really feel the negative parts right alongside any desirable parts.  I am not talking about fighting the stick off with the carrot, but rather taking a comprehensive view which involves an understanding of both.  There will always be a carrot and a stick, as long as there is a "me" inside.  The closest I can get to there not being a "me" inside is full enjoyment and appreciation.  So I am doing what it takes to get that going, and it is that simple.  

The "me" is that push and pull to do something, to make something happen, to control the situation, to survive!  It has evolved into my entire personality, the very force that is actively looking out through the eyeballs of this skull, as I type.  When this force stops resisting, it has some permission to go into abeyance for a time.  But I can't get there from here by purposefully doing something special with my attention (which would be affism, I think).  "Me" can't get outside "me", it just has to sing an ode to the wonders of this life until it sufficiently and truly feels great enough to die forever.

8/13

-It seems like one could go pretty damn far with relying on sensible conclusions based on facts while still (and despite still being in) in the human condition.  For instance, is it not sensible to feed this body healthy food?  Is it not sensible to relate to others in ways that create the most fun and enjoyable outcomes?  Is it not sensible for me to get the best possible job I can, and do keep my financials in order?

These questions, of course, do not discount the more hardcore, change-oriented notions of actualism, such as the deep-sea diving into the armpits of the human and animal identities and the unplugging (through awareness) from the wage-slave/peasant mentality (which I am still learning about, but suspect I am in desperate need of).

___________________________________

-Ingrained, instinctual programming.  We all have it.  We ARE it.  Mine says this moment is no good.  And if I feel bad enough, if I grimace enough, tense my muscles enough, than I will have an excuse to escape the task of this moment.  One level deeper, it says that society is no good.  This structure, all of these rules, this whole web of control which feels like it is strangling me.  But if I work with society's rules, I can crack the code, find an excuse to not meet its demands.  And one of these rules is that when you are sick or incapacitated, you don't have to work.  So my cunning mind devised this mode of being agitated, of being sick, to have an excuse not to be HERE, to meet these demands.

The antidote is to enjoy them.  To appreciate the acitvities that I am being asked to participate in.  To lend lip-service to society's laws and stay affectively open and positive in the tasks that I perform.  Knowing WHY I should do this seems to be a very important (and perhaps often overlooked) aspect of the actualism method.  It is not just to enjoy and appreciate in a dumb-zombie way, but to understand why you are doing what you are doing.  I can't see past the matrix while I am still plugged in, but I can appreciate the fact that I am plugged in, and choose to not follow along the expectations of stress (and its opposite of nurture) and just enjoy and appreciate instead.

__________________________________________________

-Its hard for me to even begin to think/conceptualize about apperception/PCE/pure-intent, etc. without moralizing.  Moralizing would be making it into something I "should" do, that I am "supposed" to do, because it will help me self-immolate in the end.  This moralizing is an immediate dead-end: super egoistic and affective in nature.  Apperception probably doesn't feel 'positive' in the conventional sense of swelling pride and confidence or the nurturing, loving, motherly release that comes from finally being nice to oneself.  Rather, apperception probably feels like a type of freedom that I have very few (if none) reference points for.  

Positivity stemming from freedom?  How does that feel (I know I can't affectively imagine it, but I'm going to try to model it anyway)?  Like the deepest, most complete possible sense that there can not be anything to improve or modify in this pristine moment.  Like a deeper, alien sense of confidence that does not need to be validated by me, and could not be understood by me anyway.  Like the most physically existent, blatantly obvious connection there is in the universe: matter, which gives rise to a sense of "me" through brain chemicals, being revealed for what it is and always has been; super chill, super nice, super easy, warm, fuzzy, bright, cooling, refreshing (all of these words being innappropriate in their scope, having previously been used to relate to human-affective perceptions).  

I guess, I imagine it as relief, what I am looking for deep inside, what individual sentience was looking for when it gave rise to the human identity in the first place.  And also, a sense of completely being outside of myself, completely having gotten out of (untied from) any sticky human tendrils.

I always liked the word "relief" to explain the peak experience.   It's like, there's nothing pushing or pulling, nothing coercing or driving you.  Seems like anything is possible and everything is interesting (mainly because things are no longer boring).

For me, it wasn't relief at all but something way better than that. It was more like "holy shit, I can't believe that this is something that actually happens, and how amazing it is!" I remember being astounded by this experiential realization: there was literally nothing I had to do, at all, whatsoever, besides enjoy being alive. That was literally the only thing left to "do".

Relief pales in comparison to what I experienced then. I described it in words soon after it happened, and re-reading it now reminds me of the flavor of it. Here it is, in full, with certain parts bolded which most show how the experience itself is not about relief at all.

I can see being relieved that the answer to life does exist and that one just experienced it and, isn't it great that it truly will all work out! But relief is not a word I would use for the experience itself - as evidenced by how I chose to describe it right after it happened.

Cheers,
Claudiu

===
[1] "It was also clear that really actualism is all about the PCE. That is how I want to experience life 24/7."
Hmm I forgot I wrote this! I have let the impact of that PCE fade away - look at that confidence in it I had, that I want to experience life 24/7 that way! It's definitely time for me to experience more PCEs. 

But abot the "actualism is all about the PCE" line, I am not sure I would agree, now. Actualism has been working really effectively for me for the past few months, in terms of feeling way better on average than I used to. So I think Actualism can work really well even if it's not all about PCEs. The PCE does show just how good things can get.. but even not in a PCE, even when I'm just feeling excellent, I can remark how amazing it is that life can be so good.

[2] "‘I’ am not wasting this PCE" 
I have to insert a big "oops!" as a reply to myself for that last paragraph. I wrote out that description on August 18th, 2013, but it was only until April 25th, 2015 that I really started putting the actualism method into effect (and thus not wasting that PCE) and starting to arrange 'my' matters to make 'my' life much more conducive to becoming actually free (although I don't currently think of it in terms of becoming actually free, but rather, in terms of enjoying myself more and more).

@Claudiu: Thanks for all that man.  Really good stuff.  Its interesting that PCE's can have different flavors, sounds like the type of thing a veteran can safely observe but a rookie like myself should avoid getting attached to.  And yeah, I get the idea; the PCE is beyond anything I could 'imagine' with my senses, since my senses (as I know them) are subtly and inherently, affective in nature.  This makes sense to me.  Thats why I like the word 'modelling' to describe the idea that I'm sort of trying to point my practice in the right direction through the reasoning process and some type of predicting as well.  Once again, not something to put too much weight on, but just using the energy of the brain engine here.

_________________________________________________

8/14

-Just forcing myself to be more simple inside.  Less obsessing.  I can't obsess and enjoy at the same time.  I just can't do both; the obsessing, and the impatience that it is linked to, polute the enjoyment and appreciation.  Motivation is necessary for me to break through my patterns like this.  Hearing Claudiu and others describe the PCE as a level of enjoyment beyond reason or previous experience, makes me know that it is worthwhile.  That, plus, the prima facie case I make through learning and exploring the wealth of actualist information, seals the deal for me in terms of motivation.

Work can't be "work" in the real-world sense.  Eventually, I am going to let that go.  We as a society, as a species, create the stress of "work".  Its buzzing in the air, and flowing beneath this shared psychic membrane.  However you want to describe it, the experience is real.  There is that element of rejection, of denying, of saying "no" to these vibes that I have soaked in so deeply for so long.  I am, in fact, made up of these vibes, in one way of looking at it.  

It ultimately comes down to brain chemicals, though.  Whatever interrupts that normal carrot-stick flow is the way to go.  

Life is good.  Everything will be okay.  I don't have to be perfect.  Things don't have to perfect.  Here is okay.  Here there is peace.  

__________________________________________

There is a big pivot point, for me, surrounding the realization that nothing is more worthwhile than getting actual freedom.  This means that my priorities shift everywhere.  

Beoman, to me it seems like you're just adding a lot of colorful emotional language onto the experience.  Being astounded doesn't happen during a PCE, it happens when the PCE devolves into an emotional or reactionary experience.

It's tempting to use hyperbole to describe being without emotional drivers, simply because it's such a positive state of existance, but I think this misrepresents the experience.  I don't feel astounded or stupified or amazed when I experience PCEs, I am just content.  I think relief is the best word.  It's the same kind of relaxation that comes when resting after a hard workout or standing for a number of hours.  All the little bits of the physical/mental/emotional landscape that were clenched up are just relaxed. If you look for something astonishing, or even beautiful, you're going to end up going the wrong way. The experience doesn't add anything to the world, it just stops taking things away from the world. Colors aren't brighter and more beautiful, they are just no longer ugly or boring. Sometimes I used to sit and think to myself, "it's amazing how ordinary everything is," and for some reason that seemed like the highest complement.

@Noah: There's something I think you're still not seeing about "the point" of all this, but I don't want to muck up your practice thread and keep telling you what to do. Just consider how contradictory something like "forcing myself to be more simple. Less obsessing." actually is, haha. If you want a vivid analogy, you kind of seem like the Type A Businessman (maybe Jack from 30 Rock) trying to learn how to play like a child by making flowcharts and planning out a series of activities. The most powerful thing you could probably do right now is be less serious about everything.  Don't look for motivation, just enjoy yourself.  Don't work for the reward of a PCE, just play and let that be it's own reward.  Oop, I'm telling you what to do again.  Don't mind me. I'll try to sit quiet for a bit.

@Not Tao: Grrrr you are starting to frustrate me with these corrections, tbh :p  You see, the thing is that I "get it", meaning I fully understand your point, to the best of my ability, at this time.  However, it just takes time to make the correction.  The same way that an oven has to preheat (or a furnace/a.c.) after you turn it to a new temperature, I am not likely to just change both my language and my meaning over night.  

Also, the other thing that annoys me about the approach which says that 'I am basically over thinking this' (or taking it too seriously,  --- or 'over- anything' this), is that on paper, it shouldn't work , but it does!  Meaning, I shouldn't have been able to get technical 4th path by 'thinking it out', according to the standards of the pragmatic dharma movement, but then I went and did it.  In fact, regardless of what anyone says, thinking it out, aka taking it seriously (by some standards) IS jnana yoga, an ancient and respected path to the ending of sufffering.  Its just unusal that people can make it work.

So yeah, please give my process some time to take hold (which it already is, in a major way, in case you haven't noticed), and correct me every third time or every fifth time, and not every time.

p.s. Thank you for spending the time on me all of these months.  Also, I acknowledge the emotional energy I am putting into this message right now, the inherent humor and silly human-ness of that, etc.  So yeah, not being a totally ungrateful grump here!

p.s. 2- I think a lot of people would make quicker progress with mind hacks if they took the bull by the horns more and allowed themselves to operate with that business-man mentality instead of smiling, shrugging their shoulders, and reminding themselves to bo relax about progress.  I just don't think thats how things in this world move from point a to point b, including the shape of the brain/mind.

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edit: Also, as to Claudiu's comment about PCE's, I found it to be tremendously helpful.  I truly believe we are delving into pointless semantics if we attempt to discuss the difference between a conventional sense of 'relife' and the unprecedented positivity of a PCE.  Although this word-meaning-debate style most likely benefits some people's practice, some of the time, I can say for sure that it is a dead end for inter- communication, alot of the time.  Just sayin....

8/15

What follows is a way that I hope to orient myself towards the mindset of an actually-free individual.  I sort of think of it a the Right Action/ Right Thought aspects of actualsim.  

-Things that are sensible:
1) getting a job that I enjoy 
2) making sure earn enough money
3) making sure I budget properly
4) staying outside of consumerist-culture's manipulation
5) leaving a job that I hate
6) treating the body in a healthy manner
thi7) being self-sufficient, independent, and free-thinking (where applicable)

-Things that are not sensible:
1) staying in a job that I hate because of conflict avoidance tendencies
2) indulging in my addictive personality
3) indulging in my anxiety

Overall, the goal is to become happy and harmless in such a complete way that I see myself as on a perfectly equal playing field as everyone else.  I would, in this perfect outcome, still think of myself first, but only in so much as those decisions are conducive to overall pleasure and fun in the moment.  When purified, these motives will manifet a totally harmless to others, because there is no way to directly harm others and experience full pleasure in the moment (not because of empathy feelings, but just because harming others defies basic logic of what is reasonable).  

Getting to this equality includes giving up the whole schmorgesboard of clingy-sticky human attachment.  

8/16

-Or, maybe staying in a job that I hate IS sensible, because it is what is best for my inner development. The reason I say this is because of the reason I hate it, which is that I am an anxious person who has difficulty handling new situations as well as high levels of effort.  But perhaps this is a chance to learn to ENJOY effort, in a really deep way.

One thing I am noticing about enjoyment is that I need to have certain personality traits activated before I can enjoy certain situations.  For instance, in order to enjoy learning a tough, new job, I need to have toughness, resiliency, confidence, and determination, in place.  These things are a double-edged sword, since they are tied in with my social and animal identity, but they are also necessary for me to eventually move past these identities.  Some external situations reqiure inner corresponding emotions.  Later, when the situation becomes the new norm, these emotions can be dropped.  I think accomodating dialectics such as this is very important to practice.

Life requires effort.  This is true before, and after, an actual freedom.  The only difference after, is that whether or not one is performing effort is irrelevant to one's pristine and pure connection to the actual world, as it already is.  Therefore, the effort, isn't something special, set apart from anything else taking place in this world.  And all things taking place in the actual world are inherently awesome.  

So there is a big lesson for me here.  Actualism is not a ticket out of the general challenges of life.  I still need to engage with vigor, feel optimism (thanks Not Tao), practice moderation, etc.  However, in the end, the thing that I will have to want more than anything else in an actual freedom from the human condition.  And eventually, all the other factors of my life will have to bend around my desire for this one thing.  But for now, I need to treat life as a fight that I can win, and let those character traits do me some good.

Hi Not Tao,


Whereas what I was actually doing was accurately portraying the quality/flavor of the PCE in words. Take a look at the other descriptions of PCEs at the "Descriptions of Pure Consciousness Experiences" page for comparison. Here are some quotes from the first handful:






Do those words convey more an experience of relief like you describe, or one of delight like I describe?

*

The moment where I realized that there was literally nothing to do in life at all besides enjoy being alive was certainly during the PCE itself (else how would I have realized that?) and not when the PCE devolved (which happened a little later on). The description strikes me as a fairly accurate depiction of the depth of the realization that struck me at that moment, as it was something completely unexpected (hence the flavor of surprise) and also very delightful (hence the 'positive' flavor conveyed by "astounded"). I remember a similar experiencing when I realized that 'Claudiu' was completely gone, without a trace, all of 'my' problems and 'my' habits and 'my' addictions were just gone! Incidentally, this description of a PCE from that same page conveys a similar flavor:


*

I appreciate the fuller description of what you meant by relief and it shows that I had indeed correctly understood you when you wrote earlier that you liked the word "relief" to describe what you call PCEs. Far be it from this being "pointless semantics", as Noah said, I don't doubt that you are accurately describing your experiences, and that "relief" (as in the same kind of relaxation that comes when you rest after a hard workout) is indeed the best word to describe them. What this means is that clearly you aren't experiencing PCEs - and I don't say that only going by this one word and these two posts but based on just about everything you write here about actualism. Rather, you're experiencing something else... let's call them NTEs (Not Tao Experiences).

I can get a pretty good idea of what NTEs are like, by now. In an NTE there is an overarching experience of relief, in contrast to the PCE where the experience is rather one of delight. In an NTE there's a sense of timelessness (see here), where you can't perceive time and the experience of perceiving is timeless (see here), as opposed to a PCE where time stands still and one experiences that stillness. And, during the NTE, all the little bits of the emotional landscape that were clenched up are now relaxed - as contrasted to the PCE where all those little bits are simply gone. 

I am curious why you call your NTEs PCEs, though, especially as you have indicated that you have no interest in your usage of actualist terms being correct or accurate at all (from here):


That is, since you're not interested in using the language of actualism correctly, why do you use the language of actualism at all? All it serves to do is to mislead yourself and others.

Incidentally, at the end of that thread you said "Beoman, why don't you explain the PCE in your own words, and I'll tell you if it matches my experiences." Now I have, and based on your reply to it the answer is "no". So, what next? Are you still going to call your NTEs PCEs?

Cheers,
Claudiu

@Claudiu: I like the look your taking at Not Tao's description there.  I think thats a good way to communicate in terms of actually seeing the other person's side.  Also, yeah, I suppose there is a point to semantics when we're talking about mind-stuffs.  I have some weird annoyance with the specificity of language associated with technical terminology (such as an in actualism), but its totally necessary and I suppose I gotta get over that personal schtick.

8/16

I felt something click at work today.  I had been hugely resistant to my new job for the past week or so.  I was trying to practice the actualism method while learning a new job, which meant enjoying and appreciating while being faced with huge challenges.  It was going very poorly, I felt disassociated because appreciation would cause me to space out when I normally should be focused on the task at hand.

My realization today was that I was missing TRUE sensibility (even though I was talking about it yesterday).  It is sensible that everyone has to work, and that I have to earn some amount of money in exchange for my effort, knowledge and time.  Everyone has to contribute.  It is sensible for me to want to contribute effectively, aka being good at my job.

Whatever internal actions are most conducive to ENATMOBA are the ones that I should do.  Actualism does not have to do with introspection or analysis beyond that.  It is true that HAITMOBA examines the self internally, but it is so pure and objective that there is no anxiety fueling the looking.

8/17

-The most effective actualist path for me is probably to make the decision to be happy no matter what happens to me.  I say this because self-criticism and anxiety run the show most of the time.  Perfectionism is not sensible.  Thats one distinction I'm having trouble parsing out.  I am doing just fine.  I have great social relationships, a good job, I am safe, healthy, etc.  But I have this nagging feeling that these things aren't enough.  So deciding that happiness is the right reaction to my current situation makes sense.  Of course, it cannot involve a mood switch which disassociates or suppresses...

8/18

-Today was A LOT better than the past couple of days.  I work on a boat now, it was so nice, just cruising the waters, looking at the mountains, etc.  I felt a point of great letting go, strengthened by the logic of actualism, the idea of a better way of being.  

Then later on the bus I was getting agitated, trying to get back to that point of feeling good.  I realized how silly it was to be agitated when I get just be feeling good.  In that moment, even though I couldn't neatly trace a line back to the felicitous state, I felt a cloud of positvity sort of wash over me and I just kind of let go into it.  

There is a greater sense of trust in this process, in this lifestyle, this way of being, as the right way of being (which, in actualism language, is the most sensible and reasonable, not moralistically right).  I feel a momentum right now.  Lets see how it goes tomorrow.

Lol, you're kinda dumb sometimes, Beoman.

8/19

Something interesting is happening to me.  I'm downloading a bunch more information about actualism every day.  It presents a sort of framework which cuts off my normal modes of negativity, like a cage cutting off the pathways of poison in my mind.  I think this might be what Vineeto and other AFT founders refer to as "nipping it in the bud."  [We must be ever-wary about disassociation, which would be "nipping it in the tip."]  I am also cautious to use their terminology on something happening with me, that is so new.

The human-animal, ego-soul, survival-fight-flight things that manifest (which is probably most things that happen in my mind- LOL) are simply less appealing than they were before.  Its not that I must stop them (or else), or that I have to figure out some special technique to avoid them, but rather that I am zooming out far enough to see the big picture.

And the big picture assumes a sense of hope for the human species, and for the planet earth.  It assumes a sense of optimism about my own personal development, and the freedom I will have in the future.  It assumes that the affective muscle is actually constantly blanketing and tethering this vibrant core of intellectual energy that we all possess in our brains.  

Want to see an example of untethered intellectual energy?  Look at the "Buddhavacana" essay that Beoman posted.  Its Richard's response to me on the Yahoo Actualism group.  He wrote me approximately 30 pages of meticulously researched and sourced material, basically just for shits and gigs.  Its not as if he had to write it to prove a point, he could have used his template of backlogged resposes to previous posters questioning his spiritual-caliber.  Instead, he chose to venture out into the wonderful playing field of ideas.  Love it or hate it, you probably should respect the effort and attention to detail involved.  With actual freedom, there is nothing holding the brain back from the basic joys of its highest functioning.

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I'm also experiencing a greater feel for sensibility, which brings balancing.  My mind is less prone to rampant obsessing during down-time (such as on the bus-ride home).  I realize that even if I could benefit from the super-intellectualizing about actualism, its not worth it because of the underlying stress.  I also notice that I am putting less weight into superflous decisions that I would normally go neurotic about.  Whats the point?  The human condition is actually hilarious if you look at it from the right angle (and take off those funny glasses we all wear :p).  Moderation makes sense because lots of small details in life don't deserve the attention I normally bring to them.  Plus when I regularly feel joy regardless of what is happening, there is no need to seek it in specific outcomes.

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For the record, I did a spiritual mind treatment 2 days ago and yesterday to make progress with the actualism method.  At first I thought you couldn't use law of attraction to reach a state that is technically outside of the 'mind of god' (which is part of the methods of the science of mind), but then I realized that as long as I treat for the method to work, and not the result, there is no reason not too.

So yeah, I think its working.  It sure as hell worked for vipassana.  On that note, its been exactly 31 days (I'm pretty sure) since my vipassana teacher diagnosed me at technical 4th path, so I would probably be coming out of the honeymoon period of that attainment.  So its impossible to parse out how I might be getting a boost from the post-technical-4th path integration that might be occuring, which supposedly can go on for years.  Of course, I am talking about enlightenment side-effects here, which are the same positive side-effects that could occur from any other stimulus, such as psychotherapy, exercise/diet improvements, lifestyle improvements, etc.  When it comes down to it, I still posit that enlightenement and actual freedom are 180 degrees in opposite directions (different survival motives, actual freedom=altruistic motive, enlightenment=self-aggrandizement/self-preservation motive).  

And on another note, I think my personal temperament makes me a good candidate for all of this mind hacking stuff.  I was talking to my father (a fellow spiritual seeker) on the phone, and he started joking with me about how I came out screaming when I was born and part of me hasn't stopped screaming since.  There is this itch, this objection to being HERE, to existing at all.  I think its that same itch which makes me ready to ditch the Noah.  This brain and body is ready to be free! 

______________________________________________

I just had serendipity: So I am currently in a job that is outside my field-of-study (and I have yet to get a job within it).  I have some degree of aversion to the responsibility and seriousness involved in stepping up to using my degree.  But I also have a fear of going too long without using my degree.  I tend to think of the job search as a category of expertise in life in and of itself.  Following this logic, there will come a time when I will feel 'ready', and, at that time, I will be a super-uber-yuppie-extroardinare, donning suits and perfected resumes, shaking hands and posessing a vast industry knowledge.  However, this makes no sense; it takes years to do that.  

So, it is silly to stress the job search as a point of potential security and confidence, and sensible to realize that I should just try to get it over with and get the damn job!  Everyone knows the first job is frequently the hardest to get.  To expand, the reason its silly is linked to the fact that the action is motivated by my phobia.  The reason 'just jumping in' to the job market is sensible is because it will obviously lead to the most comfortable situation for me, in the end, regardless of what my emotional auto-pilot is telling me.

Hey, there you go. 

@Not Tao: Yeahhhh buddy!

@Pawel: I liked this last post.  Your experience sounds great.  If I could reliably get to it and stay in it, it might be "enough" for me in terms of relief from suffering.  At the same time, this last sentence sort of goes against my current logic.  Also, I have recalled experiences atop mountains as PCE candidates but I couldn't recall any particular one that seemed thorough enough to be a PCE.  Anyhoo, just an interesting thing related to your word choices there.

8/20

-Lots of interesting dreams the past few days.  Everything is about the apocalypse and about the death of the physical body.  But they aren't scary, they are almost humorous; as if, since I'm not taking life too seriously in the first place, none of these life-changing events can faze me that much.  My last night's dream involved my death and gun usage (I don't want to share the details for fear of forum violations/upsetting others, even though the dream didn't upset me at all, oddly), but somehow I came back to life, and was on the run with several family members and strangers, after having visited an old friend for a short time.  We traversed a mountain on a cart-gondala-thing which was open on one side and kept going through different towns and meeting people.  It seemed that I was being watched by one or two people who may have seen my face on a wanted poster.  Then the cart-thing became a cart in a water park, which was the next town.  We went up the ramp, and then plunged directly downwards into the water; it was fun.

The interesting aspect of these dreams is that they have the obvious theme of getting actual freedom: especially since in the dreams, I am thinking aloud about actual freedom.  In the dream a couple nights ago, I remember thinking that in order for me to escape the human condition, the physical crust of the earth was going to have to open up first, or else I wouldn't get it.  This came to pass in the dream.  Then, in the one last night, when I was killed and came back to life, I realized that I had discovered some secret elixer (which was actually an internal change [actual freedom], not a physical-external one) which could literally 'cure' death.  

The reason I am sharing these dreams is that I rarely remember dreams and when I do they are foggy.  It is rare for me to recall one that is very vivid, let alone 3 nights in a row.  Plus they are getting more and more dramatic.  Also, I feel qualified to judge my dreams because my first spiritual teacher taught me several ways of interpreting the subconscious, including dream analysis and tarot cards.

p.s.- another weird thing is happening, whereby the dream last night feels like it opened up a psychic hole inside of me that I can literally feel in my physical torso, where the various energies (people as symbols) from within the dream are still buzzing.

_________________________________________________

-One thing I'm doing is not resisting my tendencies or being averse to them.  Also, I am becoming less reactive to the highs and less reactive to the lows as well.  So I have work tomorrow and I'm not happy about it (I don't really like my job).  This is a chance to not cling to the hatred of work.  Just let it pass through me and stick to the even path of enjoying this moment.  And when good things happen, the point is not to be swayed by the allure of them.  So if I get a good night of sleep, a big paycheck, a new job, or any other positive acquisition, the instruction is to simply stick to the even path of enjoying the moment, in a manner not manipulated by the situation.  The way to avoid disassociation seems to be the honest recognition on my initial reactions via the HAITMOBA protocol.  Always being authentic in how I am feeling, through and through, is key.

Interesting.  Definitely a theme I have moved in and out of through the years of practice.  It can be sometimes subtle and sometimes gross.  Lots of degrees to this 'desire for relief.'  I will say that enjoyment and appreciation seems to be depolarizing my mind fairly well.

One point that comes to mind is that I no longer wish to only have my internal perspective changed (i.e. the experience of emptiness, the experience of the observer, basically any purely perceptual shift).  Instead, I'm looking for a deep enough shift that will automatically undo some of my external behaviors, internal thought habits, etc.  I am looking to weaken the animal inside so that others experience me as a better human being to be around, and so that I do less harm (however subtle) to myself.

If you don't mind me asking, would you say that the shifts you have experienced have made your interpersonal relationships more harmonious?  Do your family members notice a difference?  Have you untied any psychodynamic issues from your childhood?  If you do mind me asking, I immediately retract the question and we can have a good conversation about plenty of other stuff.

I ask not as a challenge, but out of real interest in learning more about the perspective you have gained.

8/21

-I feel really agitated and depressed right now.  As always, its not nearly as bad as it has been in the past, before breakthroughs in practice.  I decided not to "try" to enjoy and appreciate for a few hours today, and simply to attend to these sensations instead.  I notice that when I am lacking in happy chemicals in the brain, all my actualism efforts feel messy and misdirected.  My goal seems incredibly unclear.  When I am already feeling happy, everthing feels bolstered and confident.

There are also underlying beliefs which I think are always there, whether I am chemically down (due to lack of sleep, in this case), or up.  At this point in my life I would say that I have somewhat negative underlying beliefs about myself, my capabilities, and my experience.  I actually probably always have had these.  Specifically though, my life has not gone as planned.  I have really been sort of derailed by psychoemotional difficulty.  I was planning on a certain series of events but something else has happened.

For awhile I crafted an identity of myself as a warrior, struggling against my mythic inner demons.  That worked really well with vipassana because it required mostly dumb, one-dimensional effort.  Now I don't really 'believe' in that identity anymore.  I don't really believe in any identity.  I used to have such concrete goals.  But those all went away as I stopped believing in the game of life.  Thinking there is a way out has made it worse, in a sense.

Within the actualist process, it seems like there are no certainties, no dumb, one-dimensional efforts to make, no super-obvious giveaways.  There are lots of subtleties when it comes to balancing attentiveness to negative emotions with the maximization of felicitious emotions, all-the-while avoiding disassociation.

I have to avoid moralization in the sense of thinking that I need to 'change' negative beliefs into positive ones.  I don't 'need' to do anything.  Rather, everything just is as it is.  This isn't even acceptance.  Its hard to truly take things at face value.  My brain produces a lot of negative chemicals, but that doesn't make it any less deserving or less likely of experiencing an actual freedom than anyone elses brain.   We just continue to look at whats going on, like scientists, learning about what causes what, how we tick.  

Today I learned more about how I hate the feeling of work.  How it stems from disenfranchisement and also from low self esteem (not believing that I am capable of enjoying hard work).  I really got into feeling the resistance, watching it ebb and flow.  I witnessed my human condition today.  Even if I didn't get to feeling good, its still one step in the right direction.

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-To expand on what I was writing above, and too actually shape it into something constructive, I will ask myself what negative underlying beliefs are being revealed.  Mostly it seems to be the sorrow of masochism.  I don't believe I am adequete.  Most of this comes from early childhood messages that I am inadequete.  Some of it comes from precoded human genetics.  And a smaller fraction probably comes from environmental stress in the womb.  The most important thing is to understand the general idea of a submerged belief operating seemingly independent emotions from behind the curtain.  This is human sorrow, not Noah's sorrow.  The same old story.


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-Furthermore, there are many beliefs, and beliefs within beliefs.  Beliefs are emotion-backed thoughts that form the framework for all that appears in my mind, in each moment, as I interpret my world.  My deepest beliefs seem to tint everything I do.  More surface ones only operate in specific scenarios.  These beliefs are about control, about having a grasp or a fix on the world; about being able to predict.  

The worst one right now is the idea that "I am bad" or "I can't succeed."  In the actual world, success does not exist.  The world itself is a success, in that reality is fortunate to be here at all.  This is what felicitous feelings are all about: providing an outlook that conforms to this reality.

If I feel bad tomorrow, I am going to try and incorporate some of this thinking about beliefs.

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-Some more thoughts (I'm starting to skim the fat now):  A huge aspect of what I need is called 'common sense' in actualism language, which is just the regular definition of the phrase anyway.  Obsessing about actualsim, my life, my goals, etc., is basically my definition of running from bad feelings and seeking to replace them with good ones.  The more I can short-circuit the drama of my mind by cutting straight to the common-sense solution at the core of each problem, the better off I will be.  

Basically, the thought that feels the least satisfying is frequently the right one.  One example might be when I am feeling like indulging in a habit to trade short-term pleasure for long-term dis-ease (such as overeating).  My thought is "I MUST do this thing to make myself feel better, or I will not be able to function (or I will die- lol)."  The thing I have been doing is to then go into a whole internal dialogue about  how I can avoid the behavior, etc.  Of course, the answer is right in front of me; I just have to suck it up.  This is common sense, in this case.

Another case is my new job.  I keep thinking, "I can't do this job, its too difficult, it makes me unhappy.  I can't be unhappy, or else I won't be able to function."  Of course, this is bullshit.  I can do the job.  I am an able-bodied individual.  I can do whatever I want.  But the inner brat inside doesn't like that answer because it rests all of the responsibility on my back.

So, to summarize, a lot of the seeming 'problems' I have been dealing with are not really problems at all, and can just be cut through with the blade of common sense.

Random food for thought - no need for reply: can you remember a time in the past when you weren't paying close attention to your mind?  What do you think would happen if you stopped paying so much attention to how you felt and what you were thinking?  I realized this was actually a large part of my own past neurosis and anxiety - maybe you're just feeding the problem.  Enjoying and appreciating things happens naturally when you lose track of yourself - and losing track of yourself happens naturally when you no longer feel a need to protect yourself - and you no longer feel a need to protect yourself if you stop assuming bad things will happen and just look forward to the ongoing unfolding of life.

I can but it was times like when I was in college or even high school when I had a huge amount of structure between extracurriculars, school and social life.  Now I just work and have no other hobbies.  So on my off days I don't do much and I don't feel motivated to create more structure.  It seems like its just extra effort.  Plus I seem to believe that I'm too lazy to get a hobby, which creates a self-fulfilling prophecy.  What do you think?

When I'm not doing anything in particular, my mind just wanders and daydreams.  In the past, it would usually wander to something bad and stay on that.  Now, if that happens, I just move it to something good.  As simple as this sounds, if you're spending most of your time doing nothing, this might be all you need to do.

Just to be clear, though, it hasn't been helpful for me to try to stop thinking about things.  What I mean by "moving to something good" is to reframe what I'm thinking about into a good thing.  So, like, if I'm worried about work or losing my job, I'll think about what I'm good at and all the other jobs I could do well.  Like I said in another thread, this eventually just turned into a switch where the same thoughts could be both positive or negative, and I just had to remember to flip it when I found myself on the wrong side.

More than anything, I just keep deciding to be optimistic.  It's hard the first few times when you're feeling bad and thinking about something good feels cheap and hollow - but then the feeling itself transforms right before your eyes and there's this sudden realization how little meaning the feelings actually have, even though they're so "close to home" you know?  Feeling bad is always related to something being unresolved.  When you start to think of ways things could go right and work out for the best, the whole mental environment changes to accomodate the solution-oriented thinking - which means a good mood.  This is the only way I've found where applying willpower will make a meaningful change to the mind.

This isn't something flimsy, either.  I know you have some big problems to deal with, but so did I, and this really works for me.  TBH, I've noticed a lot of my own thinking and struggles in what you write, which is why I keep bugging you on your threads, haha.  I want to pass on anything I might have gained in case it'll help you too.

8/23

-I've been getting into some weird mind states which seem like they could be entrances to PCE's.  I think they are, and not ASC's because they don't feel like recognizable jhanas, nanas or fruitions.  Also, they are linked to thoughts related to my self-immolation and imagery related to me moving back inwards, to the point of no existence: sort of like an implosion.  When I have these feelings, I get very calm and pleasantly comforted all over my body and suddenly the entire enviornment seems very nice.  Either way, I am sticking with the basic actualism method and not getting attached to them.

-Not trusting feelings is very important: not letting feelings guide my experience, my thinking, my decision-making.  I've been doing this successfully.

-I think of the 'out-from-control' phrase that Richard uses to describe the virtual freedom that he had.  I think I might be able to partially relate to this 'out-from-control' state (or maybe I am just fooling myself).  It feels like there is always a temptation to make actualist practice into another thing to do, another way to control the world.  So when I switch my attention back to feeling good, there has been a little bit too much self-awareness there; it borders on a type of tension, linked to the question "am I doing it right?"

The tension goes away when I realize that the actual world is right before my very eyes, despite the fact that "I" can't see it.  Regardless, the answer is here, now.  But the world is not here for me.  It has nothing to do with "me."  I am a part of the real world.  

To me, out from control seems to connote this idea that there are no rules to the actual world, and no rules to the process of getting there.  Generally, I am falling out of a sense of enchantment with the human-interpretive network, but that does not mean it has to happen in a specific way.  There is this feeling of not following my own social rules, as well, but being okay with that.  For instance, last night, I went out and had drinks with friends.  I usually take an inventory the next morning and try to figure out if I did anything foolish.  This morning, I didn't do it.  I didn't even want to do it.  But there was a feeling of losing grasp of the very core of social self, the part who maintains his status in society through a system of behavioral checks and balanes.  That losing grasp, I believe, is key.

______________________________________________


-I'm getting another info download.  It has to do with actualism as a way of life.  As they say, 'there is no such thing as a part-time actualist.'  If someone enjoys at some times, and not at others, that is called a regular human being.  There is also no such thing as some areas of life to practice actualism in, and some not too.  There is no separation of church and state, of business or logistical areas not to be touched by actualism, and personal areas which are to be worked on.  

My realization came just now when I was thinking about being at a party last night, and having been disappointed at myself for not being more extroverted with the women that were there.  For the first time, I trully felt inside, a conviction that I am going to have to give this up: this internal message that I am not good unless I regularly display my dating prowess.  Its not that I feel unconfident in this regard, for I have worked hard at it and experienced a lot of success.  Instead, the problem lies in the internal push to constantly prove myself, and the societal pull that I always feel from the psychic web established by the emotions of those around me and by my fellow human beings at large.  So yes, this will have to go.

There is only one way to experience benignity, delight, harmony, etc.  That is because all human beings share common instinctual issues which are at varying poles of extremes.  True happiness and harmlessness is in the exact middle-opposite, pleasant direction.  Because the issues are common to all, the solution is common to all, and is one-dimensional.

Actualism is a way of life, a way of practicing and embodying this solution.  A way of bringing the delight of the neither-pushed-nor-pulled way-of-being with you everywhere you go.  It is an antidote to the psychic web, and will inevitably rub off on people in a positive way.  Before actual freedom, I will be an actualist.  After actual freedom, I will be an actualist.  Regardless of what other people do and say, I will practice actualism.

Edit: I realized that this way of being will inevitably relate to giving up other things as well, such as self-destructive habits related to the blanketing of inner turmoil.  Alot of things will have to change, have to go. 

8/24

-I posted something yesterday about libido that I wanted to condense here.  I am this libido, it does not belong to "me".  Also, it is not unique to me- all humans have it.  Thus, 'this is human libido', as practicing actualists might say.

-Just now I realized what I needed, in this particular moment, to get back to enjoyment and appreciation: that is, I stopped asking for so much from life, I unlatched my tense perfectionistic grip, I realized that its okay for me to not have all the creature comforts that my identity craves.  Realizing this momentary freedom introduced a sense of lightness and ease into this mind.

-I have insomnia.  I have to wake up in 4 hours and work a 13 hour day.  My automatic reaction is to start bugging out, thinking of the things I did wrong, ways I can avoid insomnia in the future, fantasizing about how much better off I would be without it.  But I see this as an opportunity to practice.  My amygdala is firing off fear chemicals to my neocortex. where these signals are being processed for more complex intepretations: the beliefs expressed in the previous sentence.  

A belief is an emotion backed thought.  A fact is an observation backed thought.  My belief is that I can't do this.  The fact is that I know I can do this because I've done it many times before.  It always works out okay.  Even if it didn't, I would just find myself another job. 

Confidence or self-empowerment are not productive reactions to have because they just feed the other side of the problem.  Factual observations, backed by enjoyment and appreciation, are the only productive reactions to have.

I read somewhere, alas can't remember where now, that in at least one school of thought, there were various ways they thought one could achieve enlightenment and one of those ways was via intellectualism (not to say they all will make it of course, just that it was possible to make it via that route).  Also your route reminds me a bit of Thich Nhat Hanhs way, "Nirvana is the freedom from wrong ideas and perceptions and that views of any kind" and that appears to be the main crux of it.  Get rid of wrong thoughts and nirvana naturally happens.  That also jives with my experiences.  It seems like Nirvana is our natural state, just that we have a lot of baloney thoughts that get in the way of experiencing it.  And it also jives with why Actualism seems to help quite a bit.  In buddhism, there tends to be kind of lack of emphasis on practicing all day, more like unless you are a monk, you sit for a few hours and that hopefuly carries over to the rest of your life.  Some do it all day but not many.  Whereas I think part of the power of actualism is you are doing it through out the day. 
Anyway, I suspect part of the prob with many teachers is what works for them maybe different than what works for another and the fastest way for one may not be the fastest way for another.  Even if the paths all lead to Rome, if you start out in a different locations, then your path to Rome will look different than someone else's path to Rome, that guy may need to wear waders for all the rivers but you may need a camel because of the dessert.  That guy's advice about the waders may mostly only help those coming from a similar location.  IMO.  ;-P

Hey Eva,

A couple thoughts.  My running theory is that actualism's outcome is a lot different from any of the assortment of spiritual outcomes that are possible.  This is what makes sense to me on an intellectual level, but also makes sense in terms of my current level of practice experience in both arenas.  So that would mean that there are at least 2 Romes.  Also, I definitely agree that a personalized approach is necessary.  A good teacher is able to help their students discover their own meanings and techniques, for sure.

8/26

-Been doing more spiritual mind treatment for actual freedom, getting more results.  It seems like if I am really serious about actualism, about deep enjoyment and appreciation for more of the day, most days, I will need to change my habits and lifestyle in order to reduce my overall volume of thought.  I just think A LOT, and I feel like the bottom line is that regardless of the quality of thought and the volume I do, if there was just less of it I would have more fun in life.  The other aspect of being serious about actualism involves the idea that it is possible for life to be easy, given the advancements of modern civilization, and with enough internal change in the direction of true inner benignity.

So I'm doing a couple different lifestyle adjustments.  One is that I'm trying to get a job that I will enjoy more.  I'm applying to a couple different places right now.

The other is horse stance, which is a grounding chi gung exercise.  I don't know why it works, but I know it does: really frickin well.  About 20 minutes to an hour, every day, of standing in place, legs bent, starts to make me feel really, really calm.  The reason I haven't always been doing it is because I lack discipline, but as long as it is something that I see as necessary for actualism, I will have sufficient motivation.

Two other things I would like to try are basic calisthenic exercise (push ups and pull ups), and some type of regular, creative outlet: probably 'the morning pages', from the book, The Artist's Way.

Hopefully all of these things will lead to a more conditional baseline of ENATMOBA, which in turn will lead to a more unconditional enjoyment, which is the best way to imitate life in the actual world.

8/27

-I *realized* there is nothing seperate or special about the actual world.  'Actual' is basically just another word for physical.  While it is true that it has all of these remarkable qualities when we start actually percieving the physical world (the only world that there is), it should not be thought of as something which deserves its own label and its own sequestered spot in our mapping of reality.  The actual world is the only reality that can ever be, it is this universe.

Apperception is the physically occuring stream of perceiving that is always going on.  There is still nervous-system and sense-door activity occuring while in deep sleep or in a coma.  There is still the body's energy doing its thing.  I relate this always-running (nothing-special) energy to apperception.  Apperception can be thought of as the highest form of enjoyment.  This is a good way to avoid conflating it with other states of meditation.  Credit for this idea is to another participant on the Yahoo actualism group.

The Mood Scale:
Bad---Neutral---Good---Great---Excellent---Perfect (apperception or PCE or actually free)

Enlightenment vs Actual Freedom:

Self-Preservation instinct (immortality through experience of Absolute/Cessation)<----------------------------------------------------->Altruistic instinct (self-immolating for the collective good)
Enlightenment (permanent ASC)<--------ASC<------normal state of being--------->PCE---------------->Actual Freedom (permanent PCE)

*credit for this idea is to the AFT

___________________________

The entirety of the actualism method can be summed up by the three scales above.  Feeling as good as possible leads to more of that, and also a sense of confidence or trust in that as the best way to be.  This then leads into the noticing of the futility of anything which interrupts the best way to be.  The things that happen to be futile consist of all the social and instinctual programming that control us.  Eventually, the realization that all of this programming must cease completely in order for the purely physical and sensible self to emerge, ripens.  With that, self-immolation occurss all at once for the sake of having the best possible experience forever.

So there's nothing special about emotions, investigation, the particular layers or mechanics of the identity, etc.  All these are just accessories to the goal of being as happy and harmless as possible.  So I shouldn't spend too much time obsessing about all these minuteau.  Its better to have the big picture in clear view.

8/28

-HAIETMOBA all day every day, or at least once every five minutes.  Its the basic full repetition of the question in my head, plus a commitment to be very kind to myself, which facilitates the honest answering of the question.  Eventually, it seems like the observation of patterns take hold, which starts me on the track of seeing how stupid some of my drama is.  And thats the process, bit by bit.

body ages when its alive. when it dies then it decays.
therefore you need to go faster than nature. What nature does, is, it picks the best choices, it what also mind does.

in order to beat nature with speed is to meditate on emptiness. When you mediate on emptiness you will see what nature want to do, you need to unlock the chain, and you gain speed.

I'm having a bit of trouble understanding this one.  I get that meditation on emptiness can be seen as "unlocking the chain", although thats probably a separate goal from the one I am pursuing with HAIETMOBA and ENATMOBA.  In terms of nature picking the best choices though, I will say that it seems like actualism is specifically distrusting of 'blind mother nature' and all of the extremes of the survival package we have been born with and develop throughout our life span.

Ultimately, the goal might be described as becoming nature, rather than going faster than it.  This description only works if the nature we are talking about has only to do with apperceiving the purely physical universe, and not any projected overlay of spirit or higher energy (including the subtleties of the emptiness concept).

8/29

-HAIETMOBA again today.  

The protocol is basically:

• Phrase the question fully with mental talk.
• Find the emotion(s) that are occuring inside.  The most major one will usually do.
• Discover why you are feeling it and when it started.
• Attend to this until it fades from importance.
• Forget about HAIETMOBA.
• Ask again in a couple minutes.

After awhile it really does start to work.  This 'working' takes different forms, but frequently comes in the form of an insight about becoming more happy and harmless.

Hey Noah,

Your step 4 here is where things always got mushy for me.  I had to figure some things out for myself in terms of how to deal with negative emotions - and I think Richard is a bit weak there with his advice.  Could you explain what you mean there in more detail and how it helps you move out of a bad feeling?

I essentially replaced step 4 with: Change the nature of the thought-stream to an optimistic/positive reframing of the situation/cause of the bad feeling.  Have you seen anything like this on the yahoo group?  I mainly like it because it allows me to drop the whole thing much faster, which makes it seem less serious and easier to drop in the future.  It's kind of a cascade effect from there.

As humans we can self-realize ourselves and fight our way to heaven and save the princess. And we need to be learned so we wouldn't be like cavemen but like noblemen. 
In nature we do move first. In heaven we need to earn our place. This is a journey.

I think thats what fairytales trying to tell us. 
(sorry for the derailing, i try to figure what the myths are about)

Yo NT, I don't necessarily think the step 4 is supposed to help me 'move out of a bad feeling.'  That comes later.  For now, I'm just doing HAIETMOBA until it becomes a wordless attitude towards life.  And then, slowly, over time, "the dissolutive power of awareness" (something I got from the Yahoo group) will work its magic.  Meaning, I will be able to compare the many times I feel good in the moment with the many times I feel bad.  That, plus the uncovering of deeper negative emotions behind the more surface ones, and the commitment to being very kind and forgiving with myself, will all combine to slowly nip these negative emotions in the bud.

So basically, I think that when all the criteria are met, the bad emotion will permanently disappear, but it is not supposed to happen right away, or even slowly/gradually.  I don't see actualism as a method which does a 'cascade effect', in that regard.  Its almost as if bad feelings must dissapear eventually, when we bring a certain type of attentiveness to them with a certain conceptual background (one that is different from mindfulness).  This process requires no extra volitional movement of attention on behalf of the practitioner.

Keep in mind I also don't understand the actualism method fully yet, so I am not qualified to speak conclusively on it.

Edit: Also, don't forget that the goal is to also minimize the good feelings eventually as well.

So in this metaphor, what is nature, heaven, the princess, the noblemen and the caveman?  

Save the princess from a cave and then marry with the princess, then two fighting sides will see see no point in fighting anymore and peace will return.

@Rist: Interestinggg... I think the only two sides worth considering are instinctual-soul-heart-animal Noah and societal-ego-head-human Noah.  At least this is what I have deduced thus far in my journey for inner peace.  So I suppose that would like something like the caveman and the prince both committing suicide so that the magical kingdom could be everlastingly awesome.  Hows that?

Maybe.
Im stuck with a dream, i mean i finally understood that i was stuck with it. It reminded me a fairytail. I had couple weeks back already removed away everyday workingday ordinariness layer so i don't have much doubt left anymore. And the best is i finally starting to get an idea where i am.

best of luck!

8/31

I've been having some great clarity into the actualism method, with the help of respondents from three different threads I posted on the Yahoo AF group.  First of all, I remembered my first PCE!  This is really exciting because its considered a turning point in an actualist's career.  It was actually a memory I had previously considered as a PCE candidate but I was able to viscerally go back into it all of a sudden and fully recall what it was like.  I think this might be what Richard means by 'rememoration'.

Also, I've gotten a couple good perspectives on HAIETMOBA.  Some people say to say all the words, each time.  Others say to just get a feel for it and what it is trying to do and why its important.  Everyone acknowledges that each word in that phrase is important.  What I got from this is the importance of its function, which is to completely orient oneself towards the present moment, and the present moment 'me' and 'I', in all of their aspects.  Changing oneself only, in this moment only, is the only thing that matters.  Also, HAIETMOBA is supposed to reinforce a reflex to continuously return to this moment.  That reflex is very helpful for the actualism method.  So whichever way I end up using HAIETMOBA, the most important thing is to carry out that function.

Finally, the importance of distinguishing between emotion/feelings and thinking is super important.  I posted on the Yahoo group, saying I was "obsessing" and that I needed to think less.  Multiple people responded saying the idea of 'overthinking' was a spiritual belief, but the truth is that it is the underlying emotion of anxiety and control-seeking that is the problem.  The thinking process is an actual, inherent part of nature and this universe.  Humanities best, most useful creations occur through thinking.  I am 'overfeeling' which is causing the obsessing, which manifests on the surface through thinking.  This is an example of how thinking needs to be distinguished from feeling.

Edit: There are two more things about actualism I have recently discovered through help from the Yahoo peeps.

1) Sensibility.... is frequently (but not always!) fairly obvious and fairly simple.  I was overcomplicating it in a lot of my previous posts on this log.  Its just, what makes me actually feel good, as in, a good mood.  Like, the way I judged a good mood before learning about meditation (lol).  Or, what makes the most sense, in terms of logistical, daily-life decisions, in each moment.  What goals should I reasonably have, what do I reasonably need to get done, etc.  The answer is frequently right in front of my nose but I have a tendency to want a more sophisticated, but unnecessary one.

2) Kindness... being kind to oneself, like oneself, being light-hearted, are all good ways to get to feeling good.  Also, kindness creates an environment that makes it safe for deeper and deeper emotions to express themselves, so that they can be seen as silly not sensible.  Kindness is just a stepping-stone though!  It is not the be-all-end-all like in some spiritual systems.  Eventually, there is no need for kindness because life is awesome.

________________________________________

-I used to think that actualism had special definitions of all the terms it uses (there are a few).  I am only now realizing how wrong I was.  There is no special definition of 'emotion', 'feeling', 'happy', etc.  I was practicing it in the past thinking that I was aiming for a super-mindful, present-oriented happines.  That is bullshit!  The right happiness to aim for is the authentic, losing-track-of-time, full-of-thinking-and-internal-activity, happiness.  In fact, the funny thing is that actualism doesn't even come into play until this happiness goes away!

I'm also examining other limiting beliefs I have, with the goal of bringing more joy into my life.  For instance, whenever I talk to someone older than 40 (thats an estimation), all I am told is how much time I have to figure things out, and how I should relax.  Then, when I'm on my own, I completely forget this notion and fuck it up by worrying about money (I make enough right now anyway) or how to live my life in the right way (there is no right way).  So, I have decided to take this common advice and actually start living as if I have all the time in the world, doing things that are fun and bring me joy, happiness and confidence.  Even if I don't have all the time in the world, life is not worth living any other way, for this is the path out of the human condition.  

This is good stuff.

There's one contradiction in your post though.  I'm not sure if it's just symantic or something that could cause you problems.  You say HAIETMOBA is meant to "completely orient you to the present moment," but you also point out that thinking too much isn't the problem.  "The present moment" is such a catchphrase for mindfulness that is can be easy to boil HAIETMOBA down to just paying attention to what's happening.  But Richard usually points out, when talking about HAIETMOBA on the AFT, that HAIETMOBA is not the actualist method, the actualist method is enjoying and apreciating this moment.  Paying attention obsessively can actually cause a lot of problems, and the way you described your method a few posts above - "attend to a feeling until it fades from importance" - can actually make feelings much stronger and more serious than they are.  You also said that "the dissolutive power of awareness" will work it's magic, implying that you think paying attention to negative feelings will eventually reveal to you that they're silly and you don't have to feel them.  This hasn't worked for me in practice.  Instead, I had to actively decide that the feelings were incorrect representations of reality, and actively challenge them by changing my attitude towards what is happening - adoping optimistic thinking patterns and dropping cynical and negative attitudes.  Maybe you could ask about this on the yahoo forum.

I liked how, in your list above, you have a step specifically detailing that you forget about HAIETMOBA for a while.  Considering your vipassana background, you probably don't need any more attention to the present moment than you already have, tbh.  All you need is enough awareness to understand when you are feeling good and when you aren't.  It isn't the attention to a feeling that changes it, it's the way you judge the feeling and it's cause that ultimately changes it.  I have started to think of the process as "learning to be okay with what's going on."  When something happens that you normally think of as bad, and you get a bad feeling, the key is to change your relationship to the thought or event so the bad feeling will stop manifesting.

EDIT: If you do post about this, I'd be interested to hear what they say.  These days I don't really read the AFT or think of what I'm doing as "actualism" persay, so this may be where I've diverged from Richard's advice.  Like I said before, when I was trying to practice actualism I eventually found this part of it to be very mushy and undefined, and I had to make my own way from there.  Simply attending to how I felt didn't help me much, and Richard's explanations of how "nipping in the bud" works don't seem very clear to me.

@NT: So I think I agree with all the above.  HAIETMOBA isn't supposed to be 100% focus on the moment.  Just a little bit more than normal, maybe 40% instead of 30%, would be fine.  And this is where sensibility comes in for me, guiding each aspect of the actualist practice.  You just see what works, and do it.  

If over-focusing on negative emotions makes them worse for you, then thats silly, so stop.  But for some people it does seem to work.  Many times, just a quick glance inside will be enough to notice, "oh, I'm feeling shitty", maybe I should relax (or 'stop caring' as you've said) or have fun or be make this into a joke.  It might work in that moment, or it might not, but if it doesn't you've internally logged enough time feeling good to know that thats the place where you want to be.

I think the permanent disappearance of certain negative emotions through HAIETMOBA is always accompanied by the elimination of belief (an emotion-backed thought).  It doesn't matter whether the negative emotion temporarily dissolves, in that moment, but rather that, with enough check-ins throughout the day, it will eventually happen, through grace (or luck).  So its almost like you just set up the conditions of looking in the right way and it will go away on its own.  If that did not happen for you in the past, just keep experimenting with different ways of looking (which is exactly what you have been doing, anyway- and what I'm starting to do).

9/1

-Hello September...  So many things that happen in the mind, are beliefs.  A belief is any feeling-backed thought.  So basically any thought that reoccurs and is unusually sticky.  They are more rampant than I had previously imagined.  For some reason I had been holding onto beliefs as being rational.  I think that my mind wanted them to be rational "if 'a', then 'b'" problems so that they would have straight forward solutions.  But really, they just occur where convenient, meaning, wherever my mind needs them to to shield it from pain, or uncertainty.  Its actually pretty funny.  Beliefs are like buffers or fenders or bumper rails that allow me to travel through life unscathed.

-There were many times last night (I was out with some friends) where I normally would have dipped into a bad mood based on a certain event or thought.  However, each time I remembered the importance of this moment specifically and dropped the effort to "figure it out' or 'find a solution', instead deciding to feel good.  Also, even this morning, I could feel the pull towards the negativity.  However, I also feel an opposite pull, which is backed by carefree notions such as 'relax, its all good' and 'I have all the time in the world.'  I attribute this positivity to remembering the PCE.  From within my memory of the PCE, I can easily proximate various qualities into their nearest affective versions.  I am not trying to mimic it in its entirety, which would be automorphism, but rather let it guide me in small, subtle ways.

_____________________________

-I had a weird psychic experience on the bus today where I felt like the "floor" of my ego and psyche fell out from underneath me.  This floor was the last thing separating my individual psyche from the collective human psyche.  After this I started to sense the vibes and psychic currents from everyone around me.  It seemed that when I stopped looking at the world through my personal lens, it gave me enough space to creep into other people's lenses and catch their internal content a little bit.  I could look at a person and get a quick sense of their essence within a few seconds.  This essence was read as a vibration in my body, and would contain some basic information about who they were.  I did not try to stabilize or continue the experience, since it was basically just an ASC and therefore not useful for actualism.  

Later, throughout the day, I felt different in my body and mind, as if I was suddenly less capable of experiencing any and all emotions.  There is still a certain lightness or fluffiness I feel in my torso and upper chest cavity.  There is a certain ease to everything.  I think I am making progress because of the pure intent I got from rememorating the PCE.  I also downloaded a lot more intellectual information about how actualism matches up against spirituality, among other topics.

9/2

-Here are a few examples of harmlessness coming into play in my practice:

• I noticed a sense of disdain and/or aggression towards my roommate's girlfriend frequently coming up.  It was extremely subtle, but present nonetheless.  Most of our interactions are great fun.  I decided to stop any and all subtle bullying.  Its been a success so far.
• I am about to go start a new job in a few minutes.  At first I was trying to 'feel confident' in the sense of ego-based pride.  However, not only is this arising out of an underlying negative emotion (insecurity) in myself, it is linked up with the impressions of others, and being able to feel superior to others.  Instead of trying to feel confident (and thus aggressive), I made the decision to just focus and work hard, with the knowledge that I definitely know what I am doing in this work setting (restaurants).
• I am starting to have the feeling that my whole complex surrounding sexual conquest is bullshit, through and through.  Wanting dating success is inherently aggressive in that one wishes to 'win' the game and possess or manipulate another person in some way.  Wanting love/deep-emotional-connection is just as bad, but that isn't my personal problem right now.  The answer to both of these extremes (desire and nurture) involves being altruistically humble in social situations.  This means not suppressing or expressing any part of my personality.  The goal is to truly 'be myself.'  There are no rules about any outcomes.  I don't have to 'get girls' or 'get laid.'  I know that I will feel horniness.  That is fine.  Attentiveness to the physical feeling and underlying emotions (aggression and insecurity) is the right move then.  Don't push or pull on it.  Not trying to 'prove myself' or 'win' any games (or play them in the first place) frees me up to just be an honest, friendly and altruistic person.  Freedom!

9/3

There are all these layers to the soul.  There is the underlying tenor of pressure, self-criticism, resistance, etc.  This is part and parcel with who I am deep inside.  I am slowly beginning to feel this layer out.  This includes the impulse to write on the DhO, to think about life, to be incredibly self-aware, etc.  After this, I may just change forever.  Deeper and deeper this rabbit hole goes.... 

p.s.- I was waiting to go into work, feeling this odd sense of paranoia and tension, when I realized that these may not be my negative feelings, they may be psychic currents from humans in general, or vibes I pick up from people in the area.  With this realization, it felt like some force smacked me in the face, and I was pulled into the present moment in a wordless, thoughtless, pleasant and confident way.  Weird stuff.

9/4

I have diagramed the layers of being below.  I know that I need to go deeper because even when I enjoy myself, I feel a sense of movement, a sense of searching, still going on below the surface.  This is where 'bipolar disorder' lies.  This layer gives rise to all the obsessing I do, the reason I write on this forum every day.  This layer gives rise to the tense hyper-vigilant manner with which I moniter and rate myself, checking my pulse every five seconds.  This layer gives rise to me being hard on myself, being a glass-half empty kind of guy.

Noah practicing actualism to feel good
________________________

Noah feeling tension below surface
________________________

Noah believing he is not safe and needs to defend himself
________________________

Noah believing he is not good
________________________

Noah being wounded at early age
________________________

Noah as a sensitive kind-hearted, full-of-love child, driven by nurture and desire *the spiritual level- cessation/agape*
________________________

inside this sensitive-nurtured child, an primate full of sophisticated survival impulses
________________________

inside this primate, a reptile, full of simple survival impulses, awareness that death is possible
________________________

below all of these animal layers, an innate self... basic sense of being, created by the nervous system
________________________

an actual, flesh-and-blood body, part of this pristine and spacious universe

Something that helped me with this point was I realized most of these kinds of feelings were related to wanting to possess other people. (EDIT: You used the exact word, haha!) Even horniness is a kind of desire to consume/take/master/control (so categorizing it as "harm" is a good idea!). If you let go of these mental aspects, the physical aspects can be very pleasant without any tinge of "want" or "need" behind them. Something that helped me was to think of the people I was attracted to as "free" - like a free bird. Love and desire cages the birds - but it's just as easy to enjoy watching a wild bird as it is to watch a caged bird. If a wild bird sits on your finger, it's all the more amazing (EDIT: Not meant to be a euphemism, lol...). There's really something to the word "objectify" when considering objects of lust. When you stop objectifying, the whole thing becomes a very pleasant experience - mostly because it's no longer a drive, but rather a positive sensory addition to the world. Instead of focusing on getting the girl, you can just enjoy the phycial attraction itself - which turns out to be very pleasant and fulfilling it its own right when there's no longer something further required of it (like conquest or future possesion).  It's the concept of a "game" that turns this pleasant physical attraction into something stressful.  Really, the game is taking away something very positive from you.

9/5

-The scary thing about sensibility is that its all you have left when you strip away social pressure, pride, sense of duty, self-image, self-confidence, narcissistic wounds, and tons of other psychic forces.  So getting rid of all of those things is scary.  The other scary thing about sensibility is it means doing what is necessary, with 'what is necessary' being a nebulous thing depending on what you judge to be necessary in the moment, and in general.  This also means taking responsibility for your actions and realizing your potential.

For me this means making more money because I can and because I have the opportunity to, despite the fact that I have certain phobias and responsibility-avoidance mechanisms which haunt me.  It also means being willing to push myself in terms of everyday inconveniences such as sleep schedule and household chores.  I can do these things.  Any attempt to over-complicate things is actually an avoidance mechanism, another trick of the psyche.

Life isn't meant to be perfect.  But it also isn't meant to be this difficult.  Being willing to recognize the balance seems like a step towards the actual world for me.

9/7

Tonight I was walking into the bus tunnel station when I ran my fingers across my face, feeling my acne scars.  I had the thought that it was weird that my face was permanently scarred.  Then I realized that the only reason it was weird is because I thought it was my body.  But really there is no me. 'Me' is just a parasitic entity, created by the brain stem to ensure the body's survival.  'Me' has become irrelevent.  

Suddenly I felt so good.  There was just here.  Just walking through the tunnel, feelin the wind, watching the light play of the tiles: beautiful.  Everything felt so easy compared to one second ago.  It wasn't that I had solved any of my problems, but moreso that I just didn't care.  And the most likely way of describing it was realizing that my problems didn't actually exist.

The actual world isn't a separate place.  Its here, all the time, right before our eyes.  The only thing separating us from it are the layers piled on top of the nervous system by society and genetics.  But how long can those hold under serious scrutiny?

9/9

-So overall I think I'm doing a pretty good job.  I'm making progress; generally, my experience is less guided by my emotions; I am feeling more happiness and harmlessness at deeper and truer levels; I am having some pretty powerful excellence experiences; and I rememorated a PCE.  

I do notice I have this trend to nitpick and micro-manage myself.  This occurs across all situations and aspects of the practice.  I would be better if I didn't do this.  It could also be described as perfectionism.  This tense energy/attitude has me thinking that I have to 'fix' myself or that my emotional life has to be completely perfect before I become actually free.  Not only is this impossible, because no one's perfect and we are all a work in progress, its also overkill, I believe.  I bet I can get actual freedom well before I am incredibly psychologically healed.  

I should probably feel good more of the time just based on the simple fact that I am making progress on a good path.  This is one way to fight back against the tense perfectionism.  Of course the best thing to do would be to bring attentiveness to the emotion, feeling deeply into it.  But that method requires the right conditions.  When the attentiveness does fully kick in though, it can dissolve the emotion forever, but I can't bank on that.

I suspect it would be similar to the quest for material wealth, the same old dukkha problem, you'd never be satisfied, you'd always think you needed more perfection, more healing, etc.  If you base your satisfaction on attainments, even spiritual ones, then you will run into dissatisfaction time and again, IMO because you will always become dissatisfied that it's not yet enough.  And it becomes that old zen catch 22, the more you try to get attainments, the more you don't get attainments.  ;-P  Maybe that's why they say 4th path often comes when you give up trying and let go. 
-Eva

Yeah I agree with all of the above.  Thats why the next attainment I'm looking to get will eliminate the energy of the personality mechanism which creates the structure in which preference occurs.  Meaning, total reworking of "Noah."  I can say for certain that technical 4th did not do this (even though it has done a lot for me, including making me vastly more psycho-emotionally resilient).  

The true test of attainment for me is that I deeply, deeply don't give a shit anymore about what I have attained.  I'm just so damned satisfied that I'm ready to move on with my life; no more obsessing, no more stress, no looking back.

9/12

Things are going quite nicely.  There are very few reasons to be afraid, reasons to create problems for myself.  Sometimes I have to lower my standards, sometimes I have to raise the bar; sensibility allows me to adjust to the moment.  

It isn't that life should feel like a vacation or like paradise, its that this world literally is a vacation-like paradise (much moreso than we could ever affectively imagine).  The barrier is the problems we create for ourselves, and the fact that we are the problem.  Part of the conondrum is the great romance of life.  The promise of falling in love, the solice we find in the idea of having children and grandchildren, the pride we take in successful careers or steps taken to positively impact the world.  All of these 'healthy' things must go.  They are all creations of a little survival gremlin hiding deep down in the brain stem.  It makes sense that very few people are actually free.

But what is out there for those willing to let these things go is breathtaking.  How to describe that memory of the PCE, or those excellence experiences which have been riddled across my days as of late?  Certainly, that I was feeling "PERFECT" for the former, and "GREAT" for the latter, makes sense.  But beyond that, when there isn't Noah-content playing in the background, normal reference points which encourage my verbosity fail.  All I can say is that I look forward to leading a life rid of this being, but full of the rest of what is out there.

9/15

There have been many new experiences for me these past few weeks.  I am living hundreds of miles from any family and friends for the first time.  I am completely financially independent for the first time.  I am also working a job that I don't like for long hours, while getting minimal sleep.  But I have found that I am still able to function, where I would have doubted it before.  In a sense I am starting adulthood, being faced with all of the aspects that that entails.  I am also trying to build a social network from scratch, and that includes friends, acquaintances, professional connections, and dates.  Now, I would not say that being effective in social situations involves "just being oneself."  But I would not say that being disingenuous works either.  Perhaps the term "one's best self" is good balancing point.  So I am trying to figure out how to be my best self.

Also, I find that new jobs and situations created techtonic plates earthquakes of anxiety below the surface, in my subconscious mind.  The initial sense is that I am "overthinking everything."  However, the thought is not the problem; rational intellegence is necessary for living life.  The problem is the emotion causing the excess flow of thought.  This emotion is anxiety, or danger, or risk.  But beneath that emotion, there is another emotion causing it.  This emotion is a sense of inaptitude, a sense "I can't do it well enough."  And at the core of my being, there is a most basic emotion (perhaps a birth script), which is the inception thought that "I am bad."  So there are basically four layers that I am dealing with.

I used to think that the path of deep healing and nurture was the way to go.  However, I have effectively done a huge amount of it and these stubborn patterns still arise, even though they have been greatly weakened.  Even if I did "fully heal", what would basically be happening is that my nurture muscle would have grown so strong that it would always be overpowering my sorrow muscle.  So I would still be totally vulnerable to the ebbs and flows of the affective river that is the real world.

In order to not continue to give in to this negative birth script, but also not go the route of nurture, I need to cultivate felicitious feelings.  But the danger of cultivating felicitious feeling purposefully or willfully, is that it is easy to push away all the negative stuff into the periphery.  This would be 'disassociating.'  Somehow, I need to figure out how to ENATMOBA while not disassociating. 

To do this I need to deal with my things I fear head on.  I need to face them and figure out how to do literally just do them without any romantic story lines or affective hot air balloons of self image.  And the literal fact is that I am physically and mentally capable of living life, of performing job duties, of finding new jobs, of meeting new friends, of getting dates,  of figuring out how to spend my free time and what to do with my energy, of budgeting my money and planning financially, etc.  These things are not a big deal, despite what I want to believe.  

So the answer seems to be to commit to performing these tasks, day in and day out, realizing that these are the threads of active human life itself.  There is nothing else, there is no other way.  I will continue to have a negative birth script.  That will not go away until I go away completely, either at the death of the physical body or the true death of the entire psyche at actual freedom.  

I believe that I can succeed in doing all of these things literally and non-romantically (where I have failed at them in the past), because I am now doing them in service of an even greater goal: actual freedom.  In the past, I was performing them with the hopes that eventually nurture would be overpowering and take the pain away.  But thats not how it works, because deep inside, nurture is actually more pain.  

So being a functional person is simply a means to an end.  This makes it seem smaller and more possible, while also giving me more of a sense of need, urgency and determination.  I need to imitate life in the affective world as quickly as possible now.  And that means not fighting myself anymore, not being self-defeating and all the above.

I can do this.  

Disclaimer I'm more than skeptical of the Actualism method, so this may seem like derailing your thread, but it's possibly still useful, so here goes:

This is highly relevant for your statement, and for my response not completely missing the point, so first please explain:
1) What do you mean by "deep healing and nurture"?
2) What do you mean by "did lots of that"? What exactly happened as a result?
3) What do you mean by "these stubborn patterns [...] have been greatly weakened"?

No worries, I really do always like cross participation on my threads.  There was one that took place upstream that became a silly argument, but that seems to be pretty rare on my threads.  



So deep healing and nurture are sort of formless in the sense that they could occur spontaneously, through talk therapy, through music, or a variety of other ways.  For instance, I dated a girl who totally shifted her personality and priorities in life through painting, transforming into an incredibly confident and able person in only a couple years.  I personally have benefited tremendously from EMDR therapy which helped me cut through a huge amount of irrational phobias relating to responsibility and social anxiety.  Also, the path attainments (however you demarcate them, I am using the term 'technical 4th') had psychotherapuetic side effects.  The most recent shift has simply reduced the overall amount of negative emotion as well as the mental tendency to spiral out in negative directions.  These activities are much more quickly seen as shitty directions to go in.



I mean that I have done many hours (over a course of years of my life) of various activities such as therapy and meditation that have resulted in psycho-emotional healing.  What exactly happened was very noticable change of inner activity (as described above), as well as some automatic change to external activity (less social phobia=more easy expression of personality in many situations).  Also, willful and gradual change to external behavior has become easier and more possible: aka, I find my mind is much more malleable in a good way.  An example of this would be learning to stop dramatizing and romanticizing many things in life such as finding a 'perfect job' or trying to build up my ego in some way.



I just mean that I have less negative emotion in general, particularly after technical 4th.

It seems that I could keep trying to improve my mental health and foster emotional well-being forever.  There is no end point.  But there also seems to be no end point to wounded-nature of the psyche.  So these aspects (nurture-positive and sorrow) are like two mythological beasts, destined to fight for a predetermined eternity.  On the other hand, there does seem to be an end point with the killing off of the two beasts entirely, as well as any other impassioned activities of the identity inside.  To stop the spread of an electrical problem, you might cut off all power to the building.  To stop the spread of cancer, you cut off all cell growth in the body.  *Admittedly both bad examples*  I feel that the pick-and-choose approach to issues will ultimately fail me because they will just rearise in another form elsewhere and I will have to reapply the balm of nurture.

Also @ Berndt:

I wanted to add some things to finish out my previous thoughts to you.  Okay, so I have experienced positive change due to healing, forgiving and embracing myself.  But, its never good enough.  Also, I have known others (such as the ex that I mentioned), who have had great healing.  However, she was still screwed up in lots of ways.  Furthermore, what about all those loving teachers who abuse their followers?  How about all the divorced therapists out there (including BOTH of my parents, btw, lmao).  For me, the evidence, both first and second hand, is that nurture works, but it doesn't usually work enough.  

Okay, I get what you're saying. I agree, under certain premises, your argument sounds reasonable.

It sounds like you got quite some improvement, so congratulations on that.
Still, what bugs me is this:



(1) How do you know that? Why do you get the idea that it is a birth script? How do you know that it's responsible for all the other stuff?

(2) If it really is, wouldn't it be worthwhile to create conditions to let that thing heal? Of course there is no end to psychological change and healing all that stuff, but if this single thing is so damn important, how about healing that first, and then reevaluate what to do next?

The following questions seem harmless, but I think they're crucially important. I don't claim to have definite answers on those.
(3) Supposing that the Actualism method works and has the results you expect, and also supposing that the birth script thingy has the sort of enormous power you claim it has: How will it inform your behaviour after you don't feel it anymore thanks to the Actualism thing? Will it have no impact whatsoever? Will it still have impact, but you can't detect it because you don't notice it anymore?

(4) You want to ENATMOBA without disassociating. If ENATMOBA means to not feel unpleasant things (I don't know if it means that for you), isn't that disassociating by definition?

What I'm reading here seems to say, "I don't want to feel negative things anymore so I'm just going to try to stop feeling."

I'm reading "negative things impact me and my actions too much, and I really want actualist method to somehow solve this problem, maybe by erasing all feeling, which sounds like a wonderful thing anyway".

I just have a strong guess that it could be very deep set pattern.  With regards to it specifically being a birth script, I was just told by a psychic one time that there were odd circumstances surrounding my birth and my mom's fertility and she later confirmed to me that she had used Pergonol.  But this is too new-agey mumbo-jumbo.  Whether or not its a birth script or just my early personality and temperament interfacing with a disapproving Dad and sister, does not matter in practice.  I think its responsible for all the other stuff because I have always seen that the mind works layer by layer.  A very small movement at the deepest layers becomes a huge wave on the surface.  And these layers are acquired by age.  So naturally our earliest childhood experiences have the largest impact on our later traits.  This is a theory that I have seen continually work in practice by analyzing the behaviors of many people and spending years in therapy myself.



I would say that I am currently doing this through the actualism method (just as side-effects-- the actualism method is NOT about healing!) as well as the natural workings of my mind.  I'm just not making it my main mission in life.  I also kind of feel like I have reached a certain peak and levelled off, just since I have been at it for so long and tried so many different things.



I obviously can't possibly know what I might feel as an actually free person.  Richard calls this type of effort 'automorphising.'  A couple thoughts do come to mind.  One is that people tend to assume that life without emotion will be dead, flat and zombie-like.  That is not how it is described by actually free people.  It is bouncy, vibrant, wonderful, full of activity, and at the same time perfectly still and quiet, expressing as infinite space and eternal time.  Another thought that comes to mind is the idea that there can still be skeletal remains of various psycho-emotional structures.  They are only fossils, but they can leave behind traces in the mind after stepping into the actual world.



I just think of it in terms of very plain and straightforward terms.  When you're in a really good mood, you're not feeling unpleasant things.  They just aren't there at all.  If you were to try to imitate a good mood with some type of meditation method, you would not have that same, organic transition to just feeling good without the bad.  Instead, you would be purposely and knowingly trying to not feel certain things.  The same thing happens when people suppress bad moods in every day life for the sake of having a pleasant demeanor.  

My goal is to be in a really good mood, completely organically, all the time.  Real world common sense says this isn't possible.  The actualist method begs to differ.

@Chris:  Its true that I don't want to feel negative things, and its true that being actually free does have that aspect to it of 'not feeling.'  However, I think the statement might be a bit of an oversimplification since it only covers a small area of what actual freedom is like.  Also, I get the sense that the statement comes from the place of real-world common sense which says that what I am doing is at best, naive and at worst, plain stupid (one might say "you can't change human nature").  This reasoning is actually part of the greater structure which actualists are seeking asylum from.



@Bernd: This is definitely more to the point, and I would just add more details to the 'wonderful thing' statement, and place it as the first clause in the sentence, since it truly is the entire basis for practicing actualism.

Okay, so I guess there are 2 possibilities:

Maybe your Actualism adventure does what you hope. The AF Crowd may be on to something and this may be exactly what you need. I wouldn't know. I'm all for trying out stuff just for the sake of trying out stuff, so go ahead, more power to you. Even if it doesn't work, you might learn s.th. about you that turns out to be valuable later on.

But maybe it doesn't.
In this case, here are some ideas:


You're looking for the magic bullet, the wonderous solution to everything. After accepting Daniel Ingram's thesis "Be real; Morality ain't never done", you turn that around to "Morality ain't never done for Buddhists, but the AF crowd... I so hope that they at last have figured it out."
No, they haven't. No one has.

So, on birth scripts.
I thought that you had actual first-hand experience with it, but I conclude from your answer that no, it's only theorizing.

Anyway, I can do some theorizing, too. Let's assume for the moment that the TA crowd have figured the thing out and ask them which kind of unhelpful birth scripts there are. Here goes: (Technically, this isn't what is called 'script' in 'TA Today', but I think this is what you meant.)


These non-verbal things aren't fun at all. You can't live with them, so you insert conditionals "I AM allowed to exist, as long as [some condition]".

Let's say you have some of these. As long as they're covered by [some condition], it's not that bad, although they still influence everything you do. In this state, AF may make everything better.
What happens if [some condition] goes away? Will AF be enough to negate the impact of "Don't exist" et al?
On the other hand, what happens if [some condition] just stays? Will AF do the healing for you? Considering that years of insight meditation and dabbling in therapy didn't even uncover it for you to see directly, is that a reasonable expectation?

Anyway, here's an idea how to heal the birth-script thing:
Look at some of your favourite Brahmavihara phrases

Take those and compare them to the bunch of injunctions. They're totally incompatible.
That means: Writing those on the mind will induce some change of these or some reaction.
You may already have experienced this:

I know. Seeking asylum  

Noah, you are on a journey and you are doing what your heart tells you to do. I posted my comment because that's what comes to my mind as I read your words here and because a healthy dose of skepticism never hurt anyone.

Noah, are you willing to get into a discussion of this, or would you rather not? I don't want to overdo anything here, but this is a much deeper discussion than both of us guessing at what the other is thinking. I'll leave the decision to you either way. For example, you've claimed a certain level of attainment that doesn't seem to me to have been absorbed fully. That happens to all of us - things need to soak in. But you appear to me to be actively contradicting the insights you had not that long ago. Maybe you're rejecting them knowingly and willingly, or ?

I gotta say Noah, I am really enjoying your posts lately! I am curious to see how your discussions with Bernd and Chris will go.

@Chris:



I am definitely down for skepticism and having my views challenged.  My goal is to be as sensable and reasonable as possible.



Yes, please, lets discuss.  I am always learning and adapting from discussions (not arguments lol).



I don't know.  I'm truly not attached to what I claimed, but thats what the experience really felt like it at the time.  Plus I honestly used your old practice log, the logs of others from the AN, KFD and HP archives, direct discussion with a variety of experienced folks, and evidence from Ron to assess my experience.  It really did seem to match up.  I pretty much just trusted Ron's opinion, and I'm meeting with him again next week for the first time since, so maybe we can reassess.  I also had completed a bunch of cycles, which were followed by a big experience and a medium size baseline shift, which we concluded was 3rd path.  So the when the next one happened after more cycles, and there was a distinct taste of completion and satisfaction along this particular road, 4th seemed to be the most appropriate designator.  Anyhoo, there just labels; if I'm not done I'm not done, but I'm sure I did do a lot because I feel wayyyy different from before.

My main impression is that the paths are like energy-body-building which allow the practitioner to experience reality in a more resilient manner: specifically one that is more automatically in tune with the 3 C's, subtly taking away fundamental dukha and also therefore eliminating a large degree of conventional suffering as well.  I have definitely experienced a lot of this directly.  However, they do not seem to cause 'insights' that would definitely change the way I think (on a cognitive-verbal level).  They probably changed the way thoughts are formed but thats too subtle for me to detect.  They also certaintly didn't change the structure or basic patterns of my personality and temperament.  That is what I'm looking for, and I think that is what you are calling a magic bullet.

Insert:  But, in reference to your idea of my 'rejecting the insights', I would say they are moreso a part of my physical body than some optional way of looking at the world that I could possible reject.

For me, a magic bullet would be way more comprehensive than that.  It would have to change my behavior in the world (which AF does not necessarily do), making me super-awesome socially, able to meet and engage with anyone I want.  It would also have to give me a perfect IQ and unlimited confidence to do everything with it (which AF also does not-pardon the repitition here), sort of like the movie Limitless, where I could become rich and famous in weeks or months.

Basically, the claim is that the actually free state occurs when the parts of the brain responsible for stress formation, social judgement, and more primitive forms of survival, stop communicating with the parts responsible for direct reason and intellect, as well as direct perception of the world.  The best way to describe what results is a "paradasical, fairytale-like wonderland."  The side effect of not having emotion is just that: a side effect which has been blown up here on the DhO in the past.  There are a lot of other things which have to be eliminated first before emotions go, particularly all the deepest stored beliefs which hold the emotional structure in place.  

Now this is a very, very clumsy summary of a much greater section of the AFT website, so please don't quote me on it.  But the point I am trying to make is that actual freedom is not a state which will automatically fix all of my problems completely; that is how I have usually understood the term "magic bullet."  It is just a specific mind-hack that does a specific thing to the brain with a specific set of favorable results.  I can't know exactly how those results with interface with my current problems.  

EDIT: Sorry!  I got yours and Bernd's responses mixed up.  You said nothing about a 'magic bullet.'  I just responded to your thoughts on my recent claim and the possibility I could be rejecting the insights it caused.

Noah, in my experience the big takeaway from having a fourth path experience was that all objects are empty - they have no essence, no permanence and they are not "me." The illusion that these "things" (which include the illusion of a permanent self) no longer have the power they did immediately before that event. Experience is seen through as a construction, as dependently originated. So my question is, if that's what you saw, why still treat those things as if theyhave their pre-fourth path habitually assumed permanence and power? That may be a matter of soaking in the insight that is gained at fourth path, but my experience was that the specific insight is awfully strong and it is not easy afterward to see things with permanence of any sort, including the idea of ridding experience of negative/positive/neutral sensations and judments. These things all occur but they are finally seen for what they are.

Yes?

No?

Maybe?

@Chris



I agree that objects were seen to have no essence, although the words I would use would be different.  In the 4th path moment, it felt like me and the environment around me were one, continuous, solid chunk of reality.  It felt like "I" was a tuning fork and the world outside me was a different tuning fork and they started to synch at the same vibration, so there was no longer any subtle, perceptual tension.  So this would essentially be saying the same thing, because if its all one, solid, chunk, then there are no things that stick out more than others, and therefore no particular things have the same power that they had before.  

Also, since that point, things HAVE gotten a lot better and bad things are less powerful than before.  I would not say that I treat the same problems with the same degree of seriousness.  If anything, I have just moved on to more real problems and become more grounded.  It might not seem like I always describe them that way but thats because I am hyper-sensitive and introspective, which is actually something I am slowly working on with the actualism method.  

Overall, in terms of the idea that it would be difficult to see things with any sort of permanence, that simply isn't my experience.  It feels like reality is very real, crystalline, high-def.  And it feels like I am just another thing which is floating around in this sea of realness, completelly a part of that sea.  However, this "thing" which is floating around still feels lots of stress and has plenty of problems, and those are the things that I post about.

@Bernd:



For me, a magic bullet would be way more comprehensive than that.  It would have to change my behavior in the world (which AF does not necessarily do), making me super-awesome socially, able to meet and engage with anyone I want.  It would also have to give me a perfect IQ and unlimited confidence to do everything with it (which AF also does not-pardon the repitition here), sort of like the movie Limitless, where I could become rich and famous in weeks or months.

Basically, the claim is that the actually free state occurs when the parts of the brain responsible for stress formation, social judgement, and more primitive forms of survival, stop communicating with the parts responsible for direct reason and intellect, as well as direct perception of the world.  The best way to describe what results is a "paradasical, fairytale-like wonderland."  The side effect of not having emotion is just that: a side effect which has been blown up here on the DhO in the past.  There are a lot of other things which have to be eliminated first before emotions go, particularly all the deepest stored beliefs which hold the emotional structure in place.  

Now this is a very, very clumsy summary of a much greater section of the AFT website, so please don't quote me on it.  But the point I am trying to make is that actual freedom is not a state which will automatically fix all of my problems completely; that is how I have usually understood the term "magic bullet."  It is just a specific mind-hack that does a specific thing to the brain with a specific set of favorable results.  I can't know exactly how those results with interface with my current problems.  



The truth is that it 'rings true' to me and I am using my intuition.  I intuit the sense that what I am experiencing is one, central problem, and that it might have to do with the circumstances of my birth.  It doesn't really matter to me what words I use or what I call it, since I am just writing about what feels write in order to expose the truth.  I would not write based on my intuition-only in other people's threads, but this is my practice log, so I am allowed to indulge a bit.  Also, using my intuition usually works for me in matters of mind-hacking.



All of what you wrote looks great.  I could see how a deeper sense of acceptance+the BV phrasings could be very powerful.  As I said upthread, I just don't think nurture is the answer.  This is an insight it took me quite awhile to come to in an embodied way.  But yes, I like your reasoning about how obviously a positive (BV's) will counter a negative (birth script).  To me it just makes more sense to uproot the entire thing.

Thanks Claudiu!  Having that deep-set childhood memory that I posted about really spurred things on for me.  It makes me feel like I know more confidently what I have to do with my mind to slowly move towards actual freedom.  But I am not completely sure how to interpret this occurance so I am not posting much about it or labelling it.  But yes, long-story-short, I think its enabling me to communicate more effectively.

9/17

Something interesting is happening; I find myself automatically becoming a kinder person as a result of this process.  It has nothing to do with empathy or compassion.  Its just really simple and obvious to be nice to myself and nice to others and accept everyone as they come.  Also, I am very slowly dealing with the issue of libido.  I realize that getting laid isn't the key to happiness but I certainly don't believe that finding my 'soul mate' is either (lol).  Most importantly, why shouldn't I just keep it simple?  Why am I torturing myself?  Slowly... slowly... slowly, this process finds its way inside of my head, and I find myself slipping into the moment in the most graceful and easy way possible.  

"I don't need to fight
To prove I'm right
I don't need to be forgiven"

A great mellowness can be experienced at this truth.  The turning down of the dial.  Its beautiful.

_______________________________________________

Feel joy when you can.  And if you can't feel joy, then don't worry about it!  There is nothing that you need to be feeling right now.  There is, of course, the fact that it makes more sense to feel good than bad, all the time, but that comes from realizing the aforementioned freedom regardless.  

I'm confused by this and some of your other comments but I now don't think the issues involved are resolvable in a discussion. I think you have to do what you need to do and try to get where you want to go. Experience will out!

Chris:



I agree.  And I can see how my thoughts can be confusing, and probably actually are confused.  I'm not too worried about it.  I'm feeling better and better every day, and dealing with a lot of "stuff" all the while.  As long as that is happening, I am okay with not being able to explain things clearly.

9/18

-I met with Ron this morning.  He advised me that technical 4th path can happen lots of different ways to different people, and frequently people's personal philosophies color their experience of the perceptual changes as well.  I'm not sure what my philosophy is, although it has certainly been colored by my work with Ron, including his ability to summarize trends across a large number of practitioners (which is one reason he is an excellent teacher).  I think I understand these trends to some degree, which is why my understanding of my experience is fairly general (i.e. some vague sense of "energy body building", in which 4th represents a peak condition).  I do resonate with Ron's comment of 'feeling done' as a common marker for 4th path, as there is a distinct sense that any further vipassana I do will simply reconfirm the notion I sensed in the 4th path moment, which is that this moment is inherently complete and integral on an energetic and perceptual level.  

Also, he made interesting comments about how 4th is the end of 'linear development', which in no way means that I am finished with all types of development.  I am fairly certain that there are higher levels of insight that could be attainable, which is most likely what people like Daniel and Jenny are talking about when they describe very stringent conditions of perception.  However, I, (1) don't 'believe' in enlightenment any more-- meaning believe it is what I thought it was before, thus diminishing my motivation for it, (2) am not entirely convinced that every individual is even capable of insight plateaus past technical 4th-- it could literally be a genetic or temperament thing as far as I'm concerned, and (3) do not believe that further insight plateaus would help me in the sense that I am looking for-- core relief from the intensity of all emotions, deep change to personality patterns, and ultimately, complete uprooting of all the above.

Needless to say, even though we didn't meditate, meeting with Ron has been incredibly valuable, as always.  I do want to emphasize that although Ron shared his expert observations, I drew my own, personal conlusions from them, which are what I express here.

I am having the realization that I need to learn to do things without the aid of affective energy.  The simple fact of my specific condition is that my affective energy is almost always working against me.  This is not to be said as a generality for 'the human condition' in general, for many people have great motivation to succeed in a variety of areas on life.  But that type of aid just isn't what is meant for me.  Activities don't make me happy, and thats okay.  I have been resisting this fact for years, trying to blanket or improve my emotions through therapy, medication, mental science, and meditation.  But it turns out that what I need to do is right in line with the actualism method anyway.

-Don't let your actions be guided by your emotions.
-Don't take your emotions seriously or dramatically, but do pay attention to them and learn about them and see what they are doing to your life.
-Don't try to 'be tough' and develop some thicker skin, for this is a subtler way of trying to work within affect.
-Do realize that it doesn't really matter how my life turns out, for my life is but a speck of dust on the universe.  However, to the extent that certain decisions and behaviors will tend to imitate life in the actual world, it is sensible to follow through with those things.
-Don't try to build any sense of social identity to replace my current, warped one.  Don't try to be "healthy" or "balanced."  Just go about your business in a non-romantic, sensible way.
-Don't do things for survival, or power.  Do things because they are sensible.
-Figure out how to feel good, while acting, and despite not having the aid of affective energy that most humans depend on.

Noah, frankly, I'm a bit worried. Reading this gives me the impression that you are/have been on a road to very dark place. (Note that the following points have nothing to do with AF!)
Are you saying that zeal, enthusiasm, diligence, joy, delight, fun, interest are all things which are not meant for you?Could it be, plain and simple, that you're doing the wrong activities?Supposing that your emotions are just your mind/body's tool to indicate that you're doing the wrong thing, could it be that what you're calling 'therapy' is exactly this: A subtle yet cruel form of violence against yourself?You've thrown emotions out of the window. You just devalued survival and power. You don't want to rely on enthusiasm and real interest.

What, or who, then, remains to inform you what it is that is 'sensible'?
AF Richard? The Pope? The Newspaper? The Hoax that is the American Dream? Your mum? Some sort of intuition which is devoid of emotional qualities?

Or do you think this is not a highly important question because
?

o______O

There are quite a few important changes that occur, the least of which is the feeling of being "done." I'm posting this comment because I have never met a person who has attained 4th path who has reported anything less than a turning of perceiption on its head, a deep, pervasive and permanent change in the way the world is seen and experienced. There is no longer a hierarchy of things - all phenomena are seen as empty of essence and permanence, self included, and are seen to be on an equal playing field, having the effect of chaging the way one relates to the world deeply, permanently, without any doubt or question.

This just needs to be said.

See Daniel Ingram's recent comments about the same thing here - italics mine:

Hey Bernd,

I can see why you might be worried based on some of the wordings from my previous post, when read in isolation.  However, I think with a bit more info on my mindset and history, that wouldn't be so.  For years I have struggled with the sense of inner resistance and fatigue whenever I had to apply discipline in any area.  It has been a long and arduous road.  I truly have never been suicidal.  Thats just not the shape that my problems take on.  

Now, with a few major breakthroughs (EMDR therapy, technical 4th path, and already major gains from actualism), I am finally starting to see some relief and a possible solution.  The idea that I'm doing the wrong activities doesn't really work because it is literally all activities which frustrate me: brushing my teeth, cleaning my room, cooking food, more long-term projects, any hobbies that involve discipline that I am not completely obsessed with.  Not Tao seems to be the DhO participant who has most clearly been able to sum up my blockages through his comments on my previous practice logs. 

I am able to do certain things that have extreme ramifications--such as going to work to avoid getting fired, and forcing myself to do mind-hacking practice to obtain permanent relief-- but I have a lot of trouble doing literally anything else.  Note here that it feels like I have tried everything: most types of medication, most of the major psychotherapuetic modalities, plenty of lifestyle changes, etc.-- and that some things have worked, particularly those I mentioned above.

Much of what I do in my practice log is 'purposeful self-talk', aimed at influencing my future state in a certain way.  So in this case statements like 'my life doesn't matter' are more of a technique than an objective description.

In short, all things must stand the test of time, but I think the thought that I have expressed about ignoring emotional energy and acting anyway might be an ingenious solution and a huge turning point in my personal path.  I am having to adapt to my particular situation, as we all must.  Also, this method or way of thinking would be derived from a sensibility based on seeing facts from my personal history (not from the pope or Richard).  

Finally, I can see that you do not place much stock in my intuition as a valid source of a decision.  While the intuition is certainly a mechanism that is made up of affective energy, it is not the same type of energy that I am referring to as counterproductive.  So following my intuition, at its purest, does not seem to necessarily be a complete no-no at this point in my actualist path.  

Cheers,
Noah

9/19

It seems that there is 'actualism proper',  which are the general instructions for how to imitate life in the actual world (as contained on the AFT website) and then there is 'the things that Noah specifically has to do to get to imitating life in the actual world.'  I am finally discovering how to incorporate both of these.  Today, I have started to move forward with my plan of not relying on the help of affective energy to be productive.  It seems that as long as I am taking steps to move towards my ultimate psychic-self-immolation, I can find motivation to do things.  This is a wonderful discovery.  I am very satisfied, and feel that the path is laid out straight and narrow in front of me for miles.

Chris:



Understood.  And like I've said at various points up thread and in other discussions, my experience has changed a huge amount.  I don't specifically relate, on the level of semantics, with the terms 'empty' or 'in flow' or 'impermanent', but I do relate to things seeming to be 'on an equal playing field', and I would say that I have a sense of the incredibly solidity of all of matter (including whats in here, doing the typing), which is basically my version of not-self.  

Intuition, I think, is fine. The thing is: those things which are really important for you (i.e. probably inform your intuition) are typically those around which one feels most vulnerable. Also, this is what people usually develop weird fucked up emotional patterns around. Therefore, if you rely on some sort of intuition that is "devoid of emotional qualities" then it would seem that this sort of intuition has little to do with your actual values, but maybe with some of my other suggestions. Obviously, these were ridiculous examples, which means I have no idea where this sort of intuition might come from, if it exists. Or it's just that so far you've only applied it to trivial decisions.

The Buddhist traditions use the term "Right view" to hint at the importance of one's model of how the mind works. I think this really is of utmost importance because it informs all your conclusions about meditation theory, AF theory, psychology theory etc.
From your writing, I think a certain model of the mind is implicit, but obvious. I wonder if I'm correct in guessing that this is how you think it works:




Did I get it right?

Hmm, deep stuff here.  I'm not sure what to say.  I guess, the bottom line is that intuition is all I have: meaning, it is one of the only available resources from within my perception, which is the only possibly input anyone can have.  Regardless, I am happy with my results.  I'm moving in a positive direction.  



Yes! Right view or perspective or understanding is very important: especially in actualism.  The material available is valuable to the extent that one is able to apply it.  There are no teachers in actualism other than oneself.


Yes, you did get it right,  Well put.

9/22

So I have this overall mission or goal right now.  I've been honing it down to its most essential form over the past week or so.  It basically incorporates a way to move in the direction of actual freedom, while also dealing with the bipolar in the meantime.  Here are some of the main points (or steps) to making it happen:

1) Initially, ignore all emotional content arising from resistance to action.
2) Act.
3) While acting, check in:
          a) if agitation is still raging, just focus on continuing to move forward
          b) if its subsided:
                    i) bring attentiveness to the negative emotion, its starting point, the way it feels in the body, etc.
                    ii) if possible, start to enjoy the activity
4) In the short-term, the goal is to improve the attitude, perspective and mindset in the direction of being one that supports the actualist way of life (i.e. being psycho-emotionally prepared for daily life logistics).  In the long-term, the goal is to have no mindset: but to have an ongoing sense of enjoying this moment of being alive only (i.e. need for psycho-emotional preparedness replaced by baseline, momentary confidence and efficacy with regard to daily life logistics).

I like fractal-modelling for this type of map, especially for step 4, which is the core change that needs to happen.  It will take a certain amount of time to do this, to rework certain, personal tendencies that have long-been ingrained into my character.  And during this time, the first portion will probably be really hard.  Then it will probably get a little easier.  Then I will go on auto pilot for a time.  Then, I will become an expert at it.  Slowly, after that, I will start to gain true confidence and it will start to get fully ingrained.  Eventually, I can forget that I ever wrote any of this or doubted my ability to function with daily life logistics.  

And each of these phases will have its own period of early-effort, middle-auto-pilot, and late-ingraining, which is where the fractalization comes in.  Thinking of it this way can help me take things one step, and one day, at a time.

Of course, this whole arc of progress is only one portion of my wide and wondrous journey through life towards actual freedom.  There is still a social identity to be dismantled, and a set of animal instincts to be nipped, and a psyche to be extirpated.

What do you think of this statement, Noah: Actual Freedom is just perfect self confidence.

I sort of love it and sort of disagree with it.  I believe that anything I say in response will probably be percieved by you as 'overcomplicating it', but I will share thoughts anyway, since that is what we do on here.  

Actual freedom is the confidence the universe has as it expresses itself solely through form, as a physical body appercieving.  But 'confidence' is already a misnomer here, since it personifies matter.  To paraphrase something I read on the Yahoo group, this moment is like the best possible way of expressing this physical universe.  There is no better version of existence possible, and we are lucky to be within it.  

I know that part of my path (a process specific to me-- but perhaps an aspect that we both share) is the gaining of confidence.  But that is just another stepping stone to raise my baseline to feeling great most of the time.  

Anyhoo, I like the koanic and poetic nature of the statement, and there are some thoughts in response to it.  

There is no "I" or self, or self confidence, or me, or myself, or any of that in Actual Freedom. Anatta

Ps  

 haha , get it, Psi, with no "i"

Hakuna Anatta, what a wonderful phrase, it's a problem free , philosophy, Hakuna Anatta...

189 degrees my butt

You guys like DeadPool?

Edit, Hi Noah, sorry if I am messing up your pracitce thread, but I do think that what Richard is pointing to is pretty serious and straightforward.  Especially if examined as a "Results taken as the Path" sort of angle.  Anyway, good practice log, good practicing.

Ps

Well, Richard's rhetoric aside, anyway... ;)

@Ps:

Yeah there's definitely no 'I' in AF.  But regardless of what words we use to describe the final outcome, I'm using every trick, tool and lever I have in the process.  That includes egoic confidence.  I honestly think this gives me an advantage...

And yeah, I do agree with the 180 degrees angle, but thats just me yo.

I lolled at the last part. Maybe you didn't read the last part of what you quoted though? Let me bold it for emphasis:


Sounds like an I to me... and here's some more from A Precis Of Actualism to be even more explicit about it - with extra emphases as well of course:


Lots of Is indeed. To be clear there is no 'I' or 'me' - no identity - but in actual freedom there is this actual I, this body actually existing which is what-I-am.

Beoman Claudiu Dragon Emu Fire Golem

Yes, there is a body.  Nama



Psi

Yes, every trick tool  and lever!  Methods are methods by any means.

And I do understand the 180 degree thingy Richard is referring to, it is that it does not seem to refer to everyone else and everyone elses practice in the entire world.  But, hey, Hakuna Matata

Psi

Edit, that all sounded confusing.  What I mean is that the 180 degree reference, from what I can tell is that yes AF is 180 degrees opposite from most understandings of most people., 180 degrees away from most Religions, etc.  And that is because most Religions, philosophies, etc, believe in a self, an "I" , and not only do not attempt to cut through this seeming real "I" but actually train to support the "I", foster the growth of the "I", give immortality to the "I", etc.  But "I" am saying it is not 180 degrees opposite from everybody and every understanding in each and every case.

I am still not able to really convey what I am saying, and even if I did I will probably raise objections and junk up your thread.

Psi:



I think I do partially see what you're saying, and I admire your courage in surfing the gray area here.  That is what I try to do myself.  Part of my effort is to fully commit to actualism and not have one foot in and one foot out, the way that others in the past have.  In order to do that I must incorporate the 180 degrees idea into my working conceptual understanding, which then informs my direct efforts.  

The truth is that, in my direct experience, I don't know.  I know that my previous mediation teacher seems to think I got something called 'technical 4th path' after a huge amount of meditating in daily life over about a two year period.  I know that I got a lot of what I wanted from it, which is partial relief from the set of internal things I call 'bipolar disorder' (things which then effect my external actions negatively).  I know that there is still a lot more to do, and that Ron says that more good things will automatically continue to happen (further developments).  I am choosing to not pursue any more insight into the supposed 3 characteristics of all experience.  

I like what you're saying about 180 degrees referring to what most religions are doing to most people's understandings and not to everybody.  It could be true, I don't know.  But I like the spirit of the thought.  Here is my story about how I have come to truly believe that the ASC is, at its core, opposite the PCE, and the enlightenment is likewise, opposite actual freedom, and that the methods used to get to each of these destinations are also going in opposite directions.

I initially got a response from Richard (which Claudiu posted on a separate thread on the DhO, btw) when I tried to basically say that while the spirituality that is opposite actualism (Richard's spirituality) is 'dogmatic', where as my spirituality is 'pragmatic.'  He then wrote me a 30 page response that took me a week to digest.  It seemed well-researched, meticulous, logically consistent, and grounded in his own experience.  It pretty much won me over.  He seemed to be saying that something happens to the mind when it experiences an energetic shift after doing something different with the attention for a long time.  This thing that happens to the mind seems to be the mind getting 'outside' of itself.  But really, it is the mind working behind the scenes to protect itself from the real ending to it, by manufacturing a percieved ending.

This makes sense to me because I believe that everything is a survival mechanism and that we are all driven by them in ways that are much more direct than one might initially assume.  I have always believed this, well before discovering the DhO, or the AFT.  

This also makes sense to me because I did 5 to 10 hours of noting in daily life for over 600 days straight.  I worked with a teacher and succeeded in my goals.  Before this particular period, I had done quite a bit of inconsistent meditation over a period of 10 years.  I believe I experienced those shifts that can occur in the mind that create the perception that one has contacted something outside of it.  

As a result of this effort, this special perception, a lot of things in my experience had improved.  A lot of things had also not improved.  These things that did not improve included the actual CONTENT of my emotions.  Things that had improved where FORM through which they are percieved.  And the content of my emotions are driven by discrete and condensed mental events that take place outside of my attention.  I call these the 'impulses' or 'instinctual passions' in my 'subconscious', aka the 'animal identity.'  I can't prove that this is the format of them (the way the mind works), but I can take a good guess based on the data I have from what IS in my attention.

I am a second generation, Western yogi, and have known for years that enlightenment does not stop bad behavior.  My mom and dad were both taught by gurus that were later ruined in scandal (Muktananda, Rama Murti Mishra).  However, I did not have a working theory of why until Richard's letter to me was fully absorbed.  The thing that happens to the mind as a result of the disciplined process of attention (the myriad forms of meditation) does not change the basic structure of the dense, animal identity that we all share.  It only changes the form or process through which those impulses are consciously percieved.  As a result of this deeper root system remaining intact, the emotions still arise in a somewhat similar way that they did before enlightenment.  

It makes sense to me that this deeper root structure (which probably corresponds to the lower parts of the brain and brain stem) could be running the show to some degree (since meditation doesn't touch it-- perhaps IT touches meditation), guiding the mind to experience these waves that we call the process of insight, and to slowly experience a sense of permanence by touching something outside the field of perception (fruition and cessation). This would be something that would be programmed into all humans across the board.

Actualism would be the effort to bring the attention backwards and shine a light on this root structure.  This does not involve doing the same thing with your attention over and over in a disciplined way, so I would not classify it as meditation.  Instead, it involves LOTS of different efforts (the "wide and wondrous path") which all seek to slowly model inner and outer experience in a way that resembles truly bare experience (one in which there is no psychic structure whatsoever).  

These are my thoughts.

Please don't worry about junking up my thread, conversation is good.

9/23

I just had a big epiphany.  For a long time I have oscillated between periods of very little inner social anxiety + outer social success, and periods of a lot of social anxiety + outer social failure.  This oscillation has also occured in terms of logistics and academics back when I was in school.  The result was that I came to associate 'freedom' or a desirable end point with an inner state of mind.  

Just today, this has reversed for me.  Freedom is not a state of mind, it is the ability to act in the world, regardless of your state of mind.  I believe that this is one small aspect of mimicking actual freedom, although it is not really mentioned on the website.  It is not instruction from 'actualism proper', just something that is part of my process.

As a specific example, there have been long periods when my baseline mood was confidence in social situations, and I had a lot of romantic success.  The initial inner baseline led to outer circumstances which in turn reinforced this initial baseline even more.  I have come to fetishize this reinforced baseline of confidence over the years.  I believe that I have developed the strong delusion of believing that the right path is to aim for this all the time.  However, the truth is that my baseline mood changes (as does everyone's).  

It now seems to be that the right thing to aim for is to live a life in which I act on what I want, in spite of my inner feelings.  In other words, at times when I feel confident, I should seek romantic success.  At times when I feel anxious, I should seek romantic success.  At times when I feel depressed, I should pursue my career.  At times when I feel inspired, I should pursue my career.  I should never expect to gain some internally recognizable baseline (some shift in my subconscious or energetic field).  My final goal is actual freedom, which is marked by the absence of internal content.  

As an actualist, moment-to-moment enjoyment is the goal, and acting in the positive, moment-to-moment, without second guessing myself, is one way to enhance enjoyment.

Its kinda simple.

9/24

-Evidence that my life as an actualist is improving and becoming more dope:
          -Two days ago, I went to the park with my friends because it was nice out (even though I felt like staying in and watching netflix).  We drank beers, skateboarded, played basketball, listened to music and took walks in the woods (lots of random things I don't normal enjoy doing or engage in at all-- but I decided to fully commit to the fun).  This included doing skateboarding tricks that I hadn't done in years (and was really scared to do), including ollying (jumping down) a three set (3 stairs, from top to bottom).
          -Yesterday day, I drove a boat for the first time at the job I am leaving in two weeks.  It was amazing.  I normally would be nervous and obsessive but I decided to just be there with the experience and I ended up being really good at manuevering it in small docks on the Seattle waterfront.
          -Yesterday night, I went out to bars, decided not to listen to my emotional signals, and instead have fun with my roommate and his girlfriend.  In the process, we danced our faces off, acted silly, and I had good conversations with a bunch of girls in a playful and confident way. 
          -In general, I'm improving my habits by exercising, healthy dieting, playing guitar and practicing jhana meditation simply for the positive side effects it can have on the mind.

edit: I also saw the president of China while riding the bus in Seattle yesterday on a closed off road that he was walking down to his car brigade.  He was waving to a crowd of Chinese onlookers waving flags.  

cool

______________________________________________________

I had cool experience of emptiness today at work.  I was rolling silverware and suddenly it felt like my awareness was occupying the whole room as the normal psychic container of it shattered after I pondered dependent origination for a couple minutes.  But I saw through the sensation of expanding awareness as being also "with cause."  In the past, I would have interpreted this event to be my mind making contact with something that is outside of perception, and therefore outside of cause and effect.  Within this experience, I understood that everything is an experience, and that the causal nature of perception is the core teaching of Buddhism.  Things like these have happened occasionally since technical 4th even though I've stopped meditating.

The thing is, that in this moment (is it emptiness or rigpa or something lesser?  I honestly don't care because it felt significant to me), I could also detect that this is just a lens to view reality with.  In other words, I don't believe that this is a look at the unconditioned-deathless-nirvana Beyond.  I could feel that this is simply a potential mental effect that is encoded into the human brain by mother nature in an effort to protect her own assets.

By allowing the potential for a sentient being to FEEL that it has touched immortality, that sentient being will not face the actual mortality of the situation, which is that the body dies and so does the mind, and that there is nothing we can do about this, including no way to touch something that is independent of death.  This conclusion also excludes the possibility of truly/actually CHARACTERIZING reality in a way that hints at something outside of that reality (seeing 3 c's leads to cessation and fruition).  

The most important aspect of my interpretation here is that the enlightenment-survival-reflex (experienced as the waves of mind we know as 'the progress of insight') is not only used to protect the person from facing physical death, but also from the possibility of true psychic death (actual freedom) by mimicking psychic death through a shift in perceptual processing.

________________________________________________________________

Even though I have been writing a lot about seeking material success, I wish to openly acknowledge that it is possible I am confused.  There can be quite a bit of confusion in the process of contemplation.

It seems that part of the problem is that I am operating on a certain premise: that I should be an excited, newly independent, young man in a new city; that I should feel that the world is my oyster and that I can have anything that I want; that I should be experiencing positive emotions and achieving positive things.  The problem is that this is a flawed premise.  It doesn't work.  I won't get everything I want.  Furthermore, and most importantly, it has nothing to do with being actually free of the human condition.

What is it that I am trying to say?  I guess that this came out of rereading Richard's response to me on the Yahoo group just now.

I am tortured by my libido and by my emotions.  But, as they say, "I' am rotten to my core', anyway.  And frequently friends and family tell me that I do not have more problems or 'stuff' than the average, functioning individual, I am simply more sensitive to the average level of stuff that is there.  They also say that I am competent but not confident.  So, assuming they are right and I am wrong (meaning, I'm not really that fucked up after all), I shouldn't try to control or ignore or deal with these affective energies in some way, because I am trying to go from normal to actually free, not crazy to normal to actually free.  I shouldn't tolerate them at all.  I should try to end them.  Also, my solution and my process is just one, specific version of the solution that is appropriate for everyone.  It matters to me that this is generalizable.   

So I'm just a sensitive person and I find that everything I do is polluted by this, including my actualism practice.  The desire to control, to win, to dominate, is creeping in.  This is aggression in its purest form.  I am seeking the strength to push back against a world that I have percieved to be pushing against me from an early age.  This is a flawed premise because the world is not actually pushing against me.  It is just there.  And it is actually a wonderful place: wonderful beyond belief.  

I have experienced this in my PCE's.  In that moment watching the snow flakes fall as they basked in the soft glow of the lamp and the utter silence fostered by the trees and snow layer of the park at night.  In that peaceful dawn in which I felt that I was all alone on the pebbled beach, just me and hundreds of starfish, beautiful stars colored orange, blue, green, red.  At those times I was completely alone, and I was completely okay.  The world was not pushing on me at this times.  

So why do I feel like the world is pushing on me now?  Why do I need to push back?  Why can't I just give up, just surrender?

I think that if I was actually free I probably wouldn't want to do so much activity.  The tenor or quality or taste or glow or scent of this physical space that I occupy would continuously satisfy me.  And of course, the best language to use does not even include personal pronouns, for there would be no 'me' to speak of.  But I think thats what I mean when I say 'completely okay' or 'continuously satisfied.'  Those are states in which I disappear, or at least states which lead into my disappearance.  

I feel like there is just this wounded creature inside of me that is very sensitive to everything, to just existing.  And I also feel that this creature would be willing to give up and disappear as long as this brain and body are promised something better.  The PCE fulfills that promise.  

I know I sound dogmatic and crazy, but I am trying to really open up and write from the heart here, because I feel like I might be misguided in the way I am struggling so hard in my life every day.

Maybe I just have to get out in nature and surrender to the moment a little bit, as a Yahoo group participant was saying earlier.

I think it would be easier if I gave up on all my goals and just surrendered to this moment.  I think it would be easier if I surrendered to the memory of the PCE.  If I let that serenely guide me forward.  I think that would be nice.

Living in society is so torturous.  It might be easier to live in nature.  I just feel like living in society gives me that chance to act with power and feel powerful: to reverse some of those feelings from childhood, and to ultimately nurture that wounded creature; to allow it to finally suck at the tit a little bit without feeling deprived.  And this part of my life is the perfect storm for it because I am in a new city.  But that doesn't mean I have to give in to these conditions.  I can resist.  I can metaphorically live in nature and be independent from human society while still living in it.

Hey, so, why not just stop thinking about other people? It seems to do a lot for me.  Actually, it's kind of hard to find other things to think about - kind of reveals how much thinking is just social contemplation.

Noah, his is something I believe could be very, very useful to ponder further, exploring the issue as deeply as you can. We all have these same things going on, some more, some less. In my experience there is no fix to be had through avoidance. It is by thoroughly experiencing and investigating the nature of these things that we might find peace with them. Acceptance, not avoidance.

JMHO

It's wonderful to see you being open about your feelings and the nature of your quest.

Not Tao:



I think I am headed in this direction.  I need to handle some business, while also not being blindly influenced by societal beliefs.  I need to sustain the workings of the body and the mind.  I need to sustain the space I live in, as well as bring in some money and manage it once it is there.  I need to have a plan for how I will bring in enough money in the future so that my needs will be taken care of in the likely chance that I live a long life.

Beyond that, it seems like it is all societal thinking.  My social-romantic life is a particularly confused subject.  I am confident that sex can be enjoyed without libido.  Peter and Vineeto have illustrated this through their example (lol, not graphically).  I predict that if this brain and body were to be actually free, the remaining sensibility would still be interested in the activity of sex.  So it makes sense to pursue it now, given that the practice is to imitate the actually free life.  However, how can I do that without blindly following the social-evolutionary script which is the drive to optimize my genetic longevity?  

One answer seems to be; do not allow myself to be overwhelmed by the libido.  Instead, bring attentiveness to the sensations as they arise in the body.  Notice how it is pain, and from what thoughts it arises from.  Otherwise, go about my business, acting according to sensibility, and not according to my instincts or beliefs.

Chris:



I agree with the utility of pondering it, as well as the fact that these issues are common to everyone, and that the fix will not be found through avoidance.  I have found good use of just looking at these feelings: layers of thoughts-->emotions-->thoughts-->emotions... deep into my psyche.

While I honestly do not believe that acceptance is the final state of peace, I do know for a fact that it is part of an approach with I have found imminently useful.  Acceptance and forgiveness foster a sense of honestly and clarity that is part of getting a true look at what is going on (an intermediate step, as I might model it).  I am still entrenched within this territory.

9/25

-I am going to try to shorten my practice log posts, as per the new, common courtesy guidelines.  

-My thought today is about striking a balance between the serenity of inaction that the PCE's memory guides me towards, and the obvious need for direct intervention in my life in order to truly have the letting go of enjoyment in this moment.  My overall goal must be less drama/intensity, more sensible examination of facts and beliefs, more action based on resulting sensibility, more commitment to enjoyment and appreciation, and more resulting enjoyment and appreciation.  That is this portion of the path summarized.  

Nicely stated Noah. These may be the strings of the instrument in Buddhism - loose strings being inaction (I call it effortlessness) and the tighter strings of applied effort - the virtue of viriya in Pali
It's like the breath, in, out, in out. Then there's the kumbhaka - the pause between. My yoga teacher instructs us to dwell in the kumbhaka. What is this pointing to?

Daniel:



It seems to me to point to the need for movement towards balance in all things.  This is the conventional wisdom which seems to apply across the board.  Sometimes seemingly extreme means are necessary, but these are only to reverse previous trends.

9/26

I had a good insight today, which was that I need to zoom out even further with my reasoning and my practice.  It started with the thought of how arbitrary it is that there are 12 inches in a foot in the U.S. customary system of units.  Was this measurement truly based on a real human, monarchs foot at one point in time?  Or does it have some other ludicrous beginning?  I am sure there are lots of ways to poke holes in the logic behind he SI measuring system as well.  We take these things as objective standards: not to be questioned, but they are totally subjective.  There are a million other ways we could measure the physical world around us.  The same workability applies to all human language.  

If you zoom out even further, you can see how we have evolved as a species.  Mother nature too, is not objective, in one sense; she is random.  On other planets, there may be different species, different sexes, different realities.  In alternate realities, life on earth could look entirely different.  

Sometimes I think actualism is to appreciate the schmorgesborg of this life with the intelligence of a superior alien visitor.  In that way, enjoyment will follow, because we are simply in a playground or a carnival of colors, shapes, sounds, textures, and little interconnected, internal worlds, are we not?  

What is harmlessness?  Have I been personalizing the meaning of it too much, making it too close to home, too human, too Noah?  Is harmlessness not simply the realization that I am a thinking-feeling clump of cells, and so are you, and this world is simply a physical continuum of cells and atoms, a solid wall of matter and life?  So to hurt me or you is literally to harm a portion of this continuum of space and material we call the universe?   

Now contrast this high altitude of thinking with the zoomed-in intensity that we (especially me) normally go about life.  It doesn't seem to make sense to get sucked into my feelings as much... It just doesn't quite fit.  When understand becomes embodied, the body changes its habits.  And emotions are a habit that cause damage to the body, and to the bodies of others, as our emotions are part of one, vast, interconnected web.  Most importantly, emotions block good thought from occuring, which in turn blocks good action.  There is a best internal and external way to be, but it must be found after one has zoomed out very, very far.  

Is it spirituality, or is it actualism?  Is it emotionlessness, or is it positive emotional cultivation?  Is it the three characteristics that define reality, or is it pure physicality?  

All of these thoughts are entrenched.  My head is up the butt of humanity, constantly being bombarded by, and participating in, the affective signalling system.  Stop!  Get out!  This moment is too good to be true, and yet, here it is.

9/28

-I've been trying to do some concentration meditation, and I might also do some metta towards myself.  I used to think of these things as direct paths to an endpoint of enlightenment or some other type of trained, peaceful mind.  Now I'm thinking of them more as preliminary, waste-management tactics that can lead to a more intermediate platform of feeling good.  Then, from this platform, there can be an even more effective examination of feelings and beliefs than the one I am already doing.

I am just adding in tactics here for the overall strategy.  I am still carrying on with my other tactic of not listening to emotional signals and acting in healthy and productive ways more consistently.  The reason for adding in meditation is that I have a huge amount of tense, affective energy, in general.  While I do think much of this energy is driven and directed by feeling-backed thoughts, I also think some of it is primal and has no rhyme or reason.  I know from past experience that the best way to deal with this latter type of 'stuff' is concentration meditation.

There is something about forcing my mind to concentrate that has a healing or sublimating effect.  There is a process that occurs within a given concentration session, where I might experience resistance (associated with the 1st 3 nanas--possibly initial calmness with mind & body), then rapture (the a&p), then a much more intense type of resistance (the dark night) and then calmness of various forms (eq- low mid high).  But that process is much more surface level than a seemingly unrelated one, which I have come to believe is the proper arising of the factors of jhana when they occur in order (creating 'hard' jhana).

This second process is the one I am interested in now, because I believe that is where the true waste-management potential lies.  In other words, I don't believe it is the progression through the nanas, but with poor samatha, that leads to lasting calmness throughout the day.  This type of effort has led to another type of favorable outcome for me.  Instead, it is the FORCING of the mind onto an object, leading into the mind's SUSTAINED attention on that object, which can then lead into a type of JOY that strikes me at my core.  All this can take days, weeks, or months, it seems, and is on a different axis of development than the nanas, for I have already worn that hill way down.

Now, I used to hate the idea of mastering concentration and metta, because I felt like it packed no guarantees.  Meaning, even if I could get really good at them, I would still have to do them every day for the rest of my life in order to maintain that state with all of its positive, afterglow, side effects.  I have always looked for something that would maintain itself and not require extra upkeep past a certain level of attainment.  To some extent, I have found this with technical 4th path.

And now, the actualism method has given me a set of tools geared towards eliminating beliefs forever (nipping them in the bud, such that they no longer arise).  By removing some of the primal, dumb energy, I will have more space to work on some of the more belief-driven energies.  So my working theory is that concentration and metta are worthwhile preliminary efforts because they are setting up favorable odds for a more permanent outcome.

_______________________________________________

-I had an interesting experiencing walking outside just now.  I suddenly felt very lucid and clear.  It became exceedingly obvious to me that this moment is "it", in a very simple and direct way.  I felt very confident about this and was not afraid that I would be going into an altered state of consciousness.  It was obvious that I was moving in the direction of pure consciousness.  

I could see that all of my problems are things that I add in to this moment.  The baseline way of sensing this moment that is always occuring is bright, energized, clear, and full of life.  There is nothing that needs to be added to it, or subtracted from it.  

Actualism is moreso about this brilliance, than it is about the humanness which blocks (the social and animal identities) or obscures (the spiritual identity) it.  This brilliance is freely expressed and experienced.  It is automatically granting the apperceiving being all the riches that one could possibly ever wish for.  It somehow touches a deep, inner button which turns off the identity entirely.  

The way I am writing almost makes me wonder if I just had a PCE and didn't even realize it.  Or maybe I am still in it?  Damn.

But my previous point is that the freedom of this reality, this universe, this moment, is implicit or inherent, or already built in.  That is why affective enjoyment is what mocks it, not automorphizing meditation which seeks to willfully appreciate the fullness of the sense field.  The sense field does not require any extra work to be appreciated.  The work comes with the fact that the person doing the sensing must "agree" to enjoy it, for that is the only logical relationship to have with it. 

The PCE is just a type of sensing that can happen sometimes.  The work is to really dig deep into experiencing it, or the closest possibly proxy for it.  Then, you base your life around this deep experience.  You realize that all other states are muddling apperception out of view.  Why are we doing this?  This is a shitty way to live.  

Freedom isn't about me feeling powerful, or me not being restless any more, or me not having fear anymore.  Freedom is about me disappearing.  And with me, all my beliefs.  Or it could be the other way around: with the disappearance of all my beliefs, comes the disappearance of me.  Because really, there is no 'me', there is just a cluster of beliefs, a psychic cloud parasitically inhabiting this physical body.

My beliefs are just really ingrained thinking habits: ways I choose to 'be', moment by moment.  Actual freedom is the decision to 'be' the other way, the apperceptive way, all the time.  It is the fullest commitment to turn towards the brilliance of this perception and tune in to it so completely that you leave the body forever.  And then the body is free to just be awesome in this awesome field of reality.

I think I want to be actually free, and I really mean it, which is saying a lot.  I think I will be ready to stop 'being' at some point soon.  There is no 'me', there is only a network of interconnected beliefs, feelings, thoughts, time-space perceptions, etc.  At the center of this network, there is some core 'Noah' belief that can be turned off.  And with it, must also go all the survival mechanism that lie deeper than the social stuff. 

In fact, deeper than this core 'Noah', there is the basic, animalistic sense of 'I am', and 'this is': the creation of subject and object.  But this isn't nonduality; I'm not reshaping the way that I percieve to somehow fix the sense of duality and the tension that comes along with it.  That is actually just another way to stay as a psychic cloud inhabiting the body, but with a less tortured baseline.   

I can see farther than that.  I can see the possibility of there not being a cloud here at all.  Cool.

________________________________________________

-I don't know what it is that I just experienced (whether it was an excellence experience or a PCE), but it packed that punch of both confidence and understanding, that have weakened my practice thus far.  I understood things about the moment, and about this physical space we are in.  I felt that I was inhabiting my body, I could feel my rib cage and my internal organs.  I could feel the psychic force of my sense of sight as it continuously emerged from my skull.  

I understood that 'I' am trapped in this moment via the psychic web of collective belief, and to become free is to stop being human at all.  It was weird.  I felt like indulging and watching a movie or going out to eat a nice restaurant.  I felt a very confident sense of 'fuck it.'  In the moment, I had already won, because I was allowed to simply be a physical form doing some perception stuff, and nothing more.

I still have to deal with a lot of logistics.  I am a citizen, I have duties, a role to play in society.  But that stuff just doesn't matter that much.  It doesn't match up to the force of the purity of this immediate environment I am a part of. The utter beauty of this changing, decaying, recycling mass of matter that makes up the vast, eternal universe, is overwhelming.

It doesn't matter if actual freedom exists, because there is no progress to be made.  No actual person to make progress, only a floating psychic cloud, and no actual time to make it in, only a skewed, artificial connection between actual events.

I will continue to go about my business, but I will do so with no drama, no intensity.  Nothing is worth the fight or the stress when it is possible to be so completely destressed.

____________________________________

Reading this page from Vineeto's correspondence: http://www.actualfreedom.com.au/actualism/vineeto/selected-correspondence/corr-humour.htm

Its interesting because she was not actually free for most of these conversations, but she is still an excellent source of information for how to go about it.  A much better practitioner than I, no doubt.

In one portion of this page, she talks about how sex isn't silly, but rather "utterly delightful and sensously scrumptious."  As a contrast, she references Osho's tactics of seeing sex as silly by participating in it, and ultimately getting tired of it and achieving a true celibacy.  This method obviously doesn't work.

This reminds me of my own situation because part of me wants to be rid of responsibilities forever.  But the actual tasks of washing the dishes, making phone calls, going to work, etc. are not the problem.  The avoidance of tasks is a spiritual way of thinking.  Embracing them, in the moment, and enjoying working within the pristine field of reality, is closer to actualist thinking.

What part of me is avoiding responsibilities?  Sometimes, it seems like it doesn't really matter: just that it has to go.  I do have to participate.  I do think it comes from me basically just being a brat and getting too much of what I want at a young age.  Its weird how its warped, morphed and grown into a full scale disorder.  And then, of course, another fucked up belief I have is faith in the disorder, itself.  Its all a lot of misconception, and the solution is just to enjoy the participation.

I am already successfully doing this, so its only a matter of time before it starts to become easier and more automatic.  

Why would this experience (bolded above) have such a continuously strong effect?  I think its because I have a deeply-held worldview that has become impossibly solid and immovable.  Its crazy because its such obvious bullshit but it won't budge.  It doesn't need to budge.  I have taken inventory of it and know it inside and out.

The world needs to work.  There needs to be rules, and an organized system, and all the other aspects that we know about.  Even in an actually free world, there would still be common guidelines and understandings.  The root of my problem is the delusion that there is a possibility for me to have all of my desires be immediately satisfied, all the time.  I obviously developed this view by copying it in others (my dad), and also working it out and experiencing it in myself.  I also think I was heavily bullied by my sister, which caused a sense of continuous stress, so I needed to develop a way to feel comfort and security to not go insane.  Otherwise, the world would not be worth living in.  

Its not my fault that these problems got developed.  I was just a child, trying to make sense of the world with a child's brain.  I was inserted into a fairly stressful situation and was not all that resilient or stable to start with.  So what came out of the other end is an imperfect product: it makes sense, doesn't it?  I must be forgiven, if I am to become free.  This belief has to be unlocked, and with it, the energy of forgiveness, and after that, the realization that I can feel however the fuck I want to feel, and no one can force me to do anything.  Its actually kind of ridiculous that I could be mad at myself in the first place.  Maybe I should stop.

And the thing is, this isn't even the bottom of the bucket.  I came into this world with a set of animal instincts already programmed in.  Thats why I even felt like I had to somehow 'deal' with the adverserial energy coming from my sister, and 'identify' with the ways I percieved my dad to be interpreting the world.  We just copy problems in other, older admired people because blind mother nature tells us to.

Stop trying to replace old expectations and beliefs with new ones.  Just start with a blank slate and enjoy this moment.  This enjoyment isn't connected with particular behaviors or thoughts.  Its a reaction to the entire system, not just particular activities within it.  Anything else I do will be linked to my anger at a helpless, childhood version of myself, that was actually a violent reptile disguised as a nurture-seeking human baby.  And there is also a sense of confidence inherent in this: a knowing recognition that "oh, I can do this... oh, this isn't that scary... oh, I'm just kind of chopping things off my to-do list, one item at a time... oh, this is the good moment, and these activities are good within it"...

and an even deeper sense of actuality is to be had when I stop thinking about all of this and stop overcomplicating things.  Then I can really just be immersed in this actuality.  But yeah, there has to be a confidence, and an ease, for the basic idea of struggle comes out of the animal brain that we have.  Without mother nature at the helm, there is no concept of struggle.

I have a different view on metta meditation. Poetically speaking, it´s like nurturing seeds of loving-kindness in oneself which after enough practice will grow and bloom - just by themselves and without further effort. I am not a brain scientist, but I imagine the process as something like strengthening certain neural pathways which will ultimately lead to positive, self-enforcing feedback loops. So I do not think metta meditation needs to be done everyday forever to keep up the effect.

Caro:



I dig that.  It makes sense.  All the more reason to do it.  A little different from my overall framework, but definitely an idea to be incorporated in the interim of getting to feeling good all the time.

9/29

-More of the same today.  Act with confidence.  Quickly.  Don't think about it.  

Its starting to feel really good.  Went to Pike Place Market with some friends.  I noticed that some of the most obvious ways that malice (negative emotion towards others) and sorrow (negative emotion towards myself) manifest, is in the most basic sense of me not being able to chill.  Seeing how silly they are and choosing to chill is part of this process.

I don't think that 'hypervigilance' is required.  Meaning, I don't have to pay more attention to myself, or to this moment.  Part of it is letting go and paying less attention.  All in the direction of balance.  

At the same time, I realize that hypervigilance isn't 'bad' per say.  It is really just the underlying emotion of tension that is harmful.  The attention is actual, for at its root lies apperception, no?

=====

edit: I wanted to add that I chose not to do jhana meditation today.  I definitely don't have to do it to reach my goals.  But even moreso, part of me finds it based on flawed assumptions (whereas another part sees it as sensible).

I haven't been following along too closely, but is this your end goal these days, eternal bliss?