Very basic noob question - which sense door is this

E T, modificado 2 Meses atrás at 04/07/24 06:51
Created 2 Meses ago at 04/07/24 06:51

Very basic noob question - which sense door is this

Postagens: 8 Data de Entrada: 02/06/24 Postagens Recentes
“The six sense doors are seeing, hearing, touching, tasting, smelling,
and thinking. Anything we experience must necessarily fall under one of
these categories.”

Excerpt From
Contemplative Fitness
Kenneth Folk


Which sense door is it when there is a tightness and an aversion in the middle of your chest, or when something you're holding in your body opens and there's lightness, and so forth? When I engage in freeform psychological whatnot, those are the things that predominate. Im not touching, seeing, hearing, touching, or smelling things, and it's not thoughts, i'm not going, bla bla bla bla in my mind, it's knowings, energies and their dissipation, etc. Mostly these happen on the inside of my trunk. There's places with tension, sometimes memories come out of them. Are these thoughts? Touch, in the sense that they're a physical sensation? Thanks
kettu, modificado 2 Meses atrás at 04/07/24 09:23
Created 2 Meses ago at 04/07/24 09:23

RE: Very basic noob question - which sense door is this

Postagens: 59 Data de Entrada: 31/10/17 Postagens Recentes
Not a buddhist answer: You are most likely experiencing interoception and proprioception and their relation to emotions and thoughts. In the simple sense door classification you refer to that might just be touch - inner touch. But might be otherwise. 
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Chris M, modificado 2 Meses atrás at 04/07/24 09:29
Created 2 Meses ago at 04/07/24 09:29

RE: Very basic noob question - which sense door is this

Postagens: 5404 Data de Entrada: 26/01/13 Postagens Recentes
Kenneth Folk, once my teacher, is describing a very old and possibly incorrect version of the sense doors. And... what does it matter? Just curious.
Martin, modificado 2 Meses atrás at 04/07/24 11:37
Created 2 Meses ago at 04/07/24 11:37

RE: Very basic noob question - which sense door is this

Postagens: 982 Data de Entrada: 25/04/20 Postagens Recentes
Like Kettu, I would call this touch but, echoing Chris, I would say it doesn't matter what you call it. The point of classification in these situations is mostly the classification itself. There are only so many different kinds of sensations and they repeat with a varying degree of repetitive patterning. Exactly where we draw the lines between one thing and the other, and what we call them, is not super important. It is a little more important to try to be consistent in your labeling so that the patterns are easy to spot. 

Here is another set of labels that can be used: see/hear/feel

www.shinzen.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/SeeHearFeelIntroduction_ver1.8.pdf

I'm not posting this because I think it's better than the system Kenneth Folk describes but just as an example of how there is more than one way to approach noting.

In the end, you'll work out which labels work best for you.
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Matt Jon Rousseau, modificado 2 Meses atrás at 04/07/24 16:42
Created 2 Meses ago at 04/07/24 16:42

RE: Very basic noob question - which sense door is this

Postagens: 243 Data de Entrada: 01/05/22 Postagens Recentes
You don't "hear" background noises ? "Feel"the air against your skin. "Think "little daydreams or memories. You just "FEEL tightness (touching sensation)  sensation in your chest, FEEL aversion (thinking, possibly touching) sensation in your chest? .... they are all there in the present moment. ...you will start to increase your labeling and noting quickly .  Like others said. It doesn't really matter to much what system you use.     Not a dumb question at all 
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Jim Smith, modificado 2 Meses atrás at 05/07/24 02:51
Created 2 Meses ago at 05/07/24 02:41

RE: Very basic noob question - which sense door is this

Postagens: 1787 Data de Entrada: 17/01/15 Postagens Recentes
"touch" is the entire body.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Āyatana

There are six internal-external (organ-object) saḷāyatana (Pāli; Skt. ṣaḍāyatana), pairs of sense bases:[note 1][note 2]
  • eye and visible objects[5]
  • ear and sound
  • nose and odor
  • tongue and taste
  • body and touch
  • mind[6] and mental objects[7]

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shargrol, modificado 2 Meses atrás at 05/07/24 07:24
Created 2 Meses ago at 05/07/24 07:23

RE: Very basic noob question - which sense door is this

Postagens: 2654 Data de Entrada: 08/02/16 Postagens Recentes
E T
“The six sense doors are seeing, hearing, touching, tasting, smelling,
and thinking. Anything we experience must necessarily fall under one of
these categories.”

Excerpt From
Contemplative Fitness
Kenneth Folk


Which sense door is it when there is a tightness and an aversion in the middle of your chest, or when something you're holding in your body opens and there's lightness, and so forth?
The important thing to know is that it is a combination of things, which becomes more obvious as you practice.

In this case, tightness is touch/sensation, aversion is probably a combination of a thought and another negative emotion-related sensation, holding your body open is probably a combination of a few thoughts (the intention to open, the curiousity, the wondering) and a few different touch/sensations (relaxation feeling, calmness feeling) and then there is the lightness touch/sensation. In one second you can have a variety of sensations and thoughts which normally is experienced all together. Vipassina is seeing smaller and more exact pieces of our experience. (The bonus is that when things are seen as small piles of pieces, the experience doesn't seem so big and unchangable, it's much more workable.)



When I engage in freeform psychological whatnot, those are the things that predominate. Im not touching, seeing, hearing, touching, or smelling things, and it's not thoughts, i'm not going, bla bla bla bla in my mind, it's knowings, energies and their dissipation, etc. Mostly these happen on the inside of my trunk.

I would call most of those touch/sensations along with probably a few very basic thoughts. In reality, most of our experience consists of touch/sensations (And yet we rarely live our lives that way! Our "self" tends to focus and believe in thoughts/emotions and overlooks sensations. Live is much more simple and direct the more you live in relation to sensate reality)

There's places with tension, sometimes memories come out of them. Are these thoughts? Touch, in the sense that they're a physical sensation? Thanks

​​​​​​​Those are sensations and thoughts... and if you were able to see even more closely, those would probably exist as several sensations and several thoughts all bundled together into "tension" and "memory". 


For what it's worth, your questions show that you are really doing good vipassina. The goal is get good at seeing how lots of subtle sub-experiences create normal experience. 

​​​​​​​Hope this helps!

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